Class Dismissed: The Dismantling of the U.S. Department of Education

 🎙️ Odd Moms On Call is back with one of our biggest panels yet! 

In this episode, Britt, Chelsea, Lindsey, Midori, and Jess dive headfirst into the recent dismantling of the U.S. Department of Education — and how it's already impacting families, students, teachers, and even homeschoolers across the country. 

From the ripple effects on DEI programs and public school funding to the chaos around student loans and civil rights protections, we get real about what’s happening, what it means for our kids, and where we go from here. 

Plus, we introduce our brand-new “Hot Takes” segment with a spicy debate: Are schools childcare? Spoiler: it’s complicated. Buckle up — it’s a passionate, honest, and deeply personal conversation about raising kids in this political chaos. 

🎧 Tune in and join the conversation. Your voice matters. 

Takeaways

• The Odd Moms On Call podcast offers raw and unfiltered conversations about parenting.
• The dismantling of the Department of Education is a significant concern for many parents.
• DEI initiatives are often misunderstood and misrepresented in public discourse.
• Public education is crucial for social interaction and development in children.
• The Department of Education's role is to ensure equal access to education, not to dictate curricula.
• Dismantling educational departments without a clear plan can lead to chaos and harm.
• Local elections significantly impact educational policies and funding.
• Homeschooling is a viable option, but not everyone has the privilege to choose it.
• Teachers are not babysitters; they play a vital role in education and child development.
• The discussion around education is nuanced and varies based on personal experiences and circumstances.

Got a hot take you want to share?

Send us a message, or email us at Oddmomsoncall@gmail.com. We might just talk about it on the show!

Be sure to follow us on Instagram, Threads, Youtube, and BlueSky!

Transcript

Britt (00:33)
Hello, hello. Welcome to episode four of the Odd Moms On Call. This is Britt and I am so excited to be chatting with an awesome panel of other moms today. I think this is our biggest call so far, right guys?

Chelsea Myers (00:48)
either the biggest or the last one might have had this many people. I know. It's close.

Britt (00:52)
Okay, see, I missed the last one. that was, I'm so excited

though, because today we are going to be talking about the dismantling of the Department of Education in the United States and how it's kind of impacting all of us and our thoughts and all of the exciting nitty gritty parts of living in this kind of dystopian nightmare in my opinion, but hey. So.

Chelsea Myers (01:16)
I think we all feel that

way.

Britt (01:18)
Yeah,

so let's sound off. Let's tell everybody who's here with us today. Again, I'm Britt. I'm the host of the Odd Mom pod. And I am super excited to be chatting with you all today from Oklahoma.

Chelsea Myers (01:30)
I'm Chelsea. ⁓ I also host Quiet Connection postpartum mental health and I am super excited to be back with Odd Moms from a very rainy yucky day in Vermont.

Lindsey Basler (01:43)
Hi, I'm Lindsay. I am a host here, a mother and artist, and I'm coming to you from Missouri.

Midori (01:50)
Hi, I'm Midori and I'm in the Chicago land area in Illinois. And my husband I host a podcast called Simply Midori. On to you Jess.

Jess Rabon (she/her) (02:03)
Hi, I'm Jess. I am the host of Psych Talk Podcast and I am coming from you from South Carolina.

Chelsea Myers (02:09)
We're everywhere.

Britt (02:11)
Yeah, it's so this episode has been being in Oklahoma. We have the superintendent who just absolutely wants to be Trump's next pick me. And so it's been a wild few weeks. ⁓ All four of my kids are currently in the public school system here in Oklahoma. So ⁓ the impacts and changes have been pretty insane for me.

But for those of y'all who may not have been super impacted or kind of haven't been necessarily keeping up with it, in March of 2025, President Trump signed an executive order directing the closure of the Department of Education. And this was aiming to transfer the educational authority back to the states and local communities, which is interesting because that's where it was, But despite that,

Education Secretary Linda McMahone ⁓ is overseeing McMahon, McMahone.

Chelsea Myers (03:12)
McMahon. yeah,

she's the she's the wrestler dude's wife. Yeah.

Britt (03:17)
That's okay, I wanted to

make sure I was like, yeah, wasn't she like the WWE? I think that the corporal punishment that we're coming from is I think that's a phenomenal addition to schools, but not free lunches though, it's fine. I'm not bitter. ⁓ But she is currently overseeing this transition, which includes significant staff reductions.

and policy shifts that are impacting individual states even more so in significant areas. So like here in Oklahoma, where we are the very bottom of the barrel for education, ⁓ are thrilled about these policy changes, which is mind blowing because it's been a nightmare over here. ⁓ But in that, there has been over 1300 employees federally that

which is nearly half of the department's workforce were laid off, ⁓ which has kind of started to raise concerns about the department's ability to perform core functions such as funding administration, student loans, as somebody who just dropped out of grad school because of all of this dismantling of the education. I was in grad school for my master's in human relations with a specialty in inclusive leadership. ⁓

DEI related, if obviously. So the program was literally under thoughts of being cut off. I was at the University of Oklahoma. So you can see how that is not necessarily two things that goes well together. But then especially when all the student loan stuff started coming up, ⁓ that's a big concern for people who are currently pursuing education. And so it's been kind of wild.

so with that though, that also impinges on civil rights enforcement, but overall there's been a huge coalition of about 19 states that have been led by democratic attorney generals. ⁓ and they have all filed lawsuits against Trump administration directives, arguing that these dismantling efforts are unconstitutional, which they are, and that they threaten vital educational funding.

⁓ And because of that, that has led to the directive to end DEI programs in public schools, but also in universities we're seeing now as well, which has led to states contending that these moves jeopardize efforts to ensure equal access to education. And here in Oklahoma, you know, our state funding is pushing for these.

Public or private school vouchers and things like that, which are taking money from our public schools and helping and taking the federal funding and diverting them to private schools is essentially so it takes people who can already afford a private education and is giving them funds and taking funds away from our public school education system, which has been really awful for.

⁓ a public school system that's already at like the bottom of the barrel. So these dismantling of the department, you know, strips away essential funding, it weakens civil rights protections, and it's leaving students and low income families without this necessary support ⁓ across the board. And this is for people.

And in all now we're seeing it all the way through the university levels. Harvard has been having big fights, things like that. and on the university side, it's now impacting the processing of income driven repayment plans,

So plans are underway to transfer these student loan responsibilities to the Small Business Administration. And now we've even seen this executive order that's come out that is saying any kind of late payments or anything like that are now going to be, as of May 5th, I think is what the order said, going to be having up to wages garnished. Like American families

i.e. myself at the bottom or side of the middle class are already barely scraping by. And so this has been incredibly detrimental to a ton of what's been going on. So how, I'm gonna take a pause here and kind of open it up to everybody now that we kind of have the like down low of what has been shifting and how this has impacted.

Are any of y'all seeing this impacting your direct lives kind of across the country? And if so, like, please sound off.

Chelsea Myers (08:06)
⁓ I'm just going to jump in because there were so many things. ⁓ so like, thank you, Britt for giving, cause that was a beautiful, like condensing of everything that's happened. Not just like, since Trump has been elected, this is like, all of this has been evolving over the last like two weeks. I feel like things have just been shifting and changing. ⁓

Britt (08:32)
I think like at first there was so many people like when the first executive order that came out about the dismantling it was so vague and there wasn't any actually action plans and so a lot of people I think didn't take it seriously because they were like it's just it's the concepts of a plan y'all ⁓ but I think in the last two weeks it's turned very very real for most of us.

Chelsea Myers (08:55)
Yes, absolutely. I hate saying I'm not, so I'm not disappointed in my state. If you are following OddMoms on Instagram, Vermont's been doing some pretty badass things and making some waves. So it's not my state, but I am incredibly disappointed in our Secretary of Education.

and our governor right now. So one of the things that I think the deadline was yesterday, Trump gave school districts across the entire country 10 days to sign whatever you want to call it. I don't know, sign something that says that, please somebody jump in and correct me. Because it wasn't directly saying like we're not following DEI.

But that was what it was if you read in between the lines. It was like, we're not implementing DEI in our schools. Yeah, Britt, what?

Britt (09:54)
I'm Googling so I can make sure that I'm educated before I speak because I because Oklahoma has been doing this a lot ⁓ and Oklahoma currently they ⁓ put out a hold on. I'm trying. Let me find my email literally from our state superintendent because what's actually been like coming out in Oklahoma is terrifying.

Chelsea Myers (09:56)
good. Okay good.

Okay.

Okay, well, so again, taking this with the knowledge that I don't know the direct wording, and hopefully, Britt is going to find this for us. School districts across the country were given 10 days to sign something saying that they were going to comply with what Trump wanted. And a lot of that had to do with DEI initiatives. And if not, then federal funding was going to be pulled, or was going to be stopped. ⁓ And surrounding states...

stood up and said, fuck that, we're not doing that. And I fully believed in my brave little state that we were gonna do the same thing. And the head of the Department of Education here in Vermont sent letters to every superintendent saying, sign this, you have to sign this. And we all lost our shit. I'm a former educator, but I'm also a parent.

⁓ all around the state, all went nuts. We were trying to call all of our representatives, the governor's office. couldn't even reach, you couldn't even leave a message. and then all of a sudden they changed their tune and said, okay, you don't need to sign anything. We're going to send a letter in saying that we're in compliance. so they did, they tucked their tail between their legs and just did it a different way. And it disgusts me.

yeah it's ⁓ it drives me insane that that we are able to feel empowered and make change and see change and then in this situation like this is fucking vermont like this is vermont this is Bernie Town this is like like what we are not

gonna follow those initiatives. So the fact that she just went ahead and sent that letter like, nope, we're in compliance, thanks. Like, no, no, no. I mean, anybody else?

Britt (12:12)
Yeah, it's been crazy. Okay, so I have in Oklahoma specifically our superintendent sent out a thing to all the districts saying that Oklahoma will be withholding that the state funding will be withholding federal funds from school districts that don't certify that they aren't using diversity, equity and inclusion programs. The state superintendent announced Tuesday ⁓

is the beginning of efforts nationwide to restrict funding for public schools that disobey President Donald Trump's orders. So Superintendent Ryan Walters, who is the most infamous, horrific superintendent to EverGrace, Oklahoma, and that's saying something, ⁓ said that the state's education departments will halt subsidies for any districts that have not yet signed a letter issued by the US Department of Education earlier this month.

So the withholding would start Friday, April 25th. So it would have started yesterday as of the day of this recording. For the districts that did not sign the federal certification. And so like my kids, were not in Oklahoma City Public Schools, at a nearby, I don't know, I guess, subdivision. No, I don't even know what I'm looking for.

We're in a small town that's like a little north of Oklahoma City and we're in their public school district and ⁓ they have canceled the culture club at my kid's school now, ⁓ which was ran by one of my bestest friends who's one of the most incredible teachers at that school. She's a fourth grade teacher and she is a ⁓ legally documented immigrant from the UK.

and came over and started the program because she was often getting asked about her accent as like somebody who didn't have a lot of, there's not a lot of diversity here in Oklahoma, especially in that nicer area. And so ⁓ when we started having kids that,

were diverse coming in, they were struggling with bullying. So she started this culture club to kind of help start to educate kids about different countries from all over the world. And because it is now a DEI and it is a sign that one of the schools in the public school district is not applying or is doing these DEI initiatives that they're now cutting her program because

It was even though it was an afterschool program that was completely free, completely voluntary. ⁓ It was a ⁓ program that was promoting DEI in the public school. So it's just like absolutely wild that this is the, it's the Title VI of Civil Rights Act, which prohibits race-based discrimination in federally funded programs, i.e. anti-white race-based discrimination.

is what the problem is as a condition to continuing receiving federal funds. So it makes it clear, it says, but the certification document makes it clear that the department under Trump and Secretary of Education, ⁓ Linda McMahon, considers DEI programming to be a violation of the anti-discrimination law because they think it promotes discrimination against white people, which is quite

confusing. So I struggle big time with this. And it's now like my fifth grader said that she's struggling if she wants to remain friends with one of her closest friends she's known since first grade, because he started spewing. She said, mommy, he was talking bad about Mexicans and he doesn't know that even though I don't look Mexican, I'm Mexican. And like,

But my fifth grader. so she's like, I don't know if I can keep being his friend because all he talks about is how much his parents love Trump and how he can't wait till there's no Mexicans, but I'm a Mexican. And so it's wild, even though my very white appealing kids are now seeing these attacks against their own cultures that just because it's just wild. It's been a life experience over here the last week.

Jess Rabon (she/her) (16:33)
Yeah, I know in South Carolina, I think this was back in February, but one of our local school districts and South Carolina for anybody that doesn't know is a very red state. There are very few blue counties lost a, I think it was $13.5 million grant, which the grant was to train and retain teachers in turn promoting better

outcomes for students and their grant funding was pulled because DEI. And the county is pushing back saying like, it's not a DEI initiative, but I'm like, okay, so you're trying to train, retain and promote education for children. And I don't know how low Oklahoma ranks if you're actually last. I mean, South Carolina's

up there and being last two. think we're 42nd or 46th.

Britt (17:33)
I think we're 49.

Jess Rabon (she/her) (17:34)
Okay, so we're similar.

Britt (17:38)
Yeah, yeah,

we're quite close. ⁓

Jess Rabon (she/her) (17:42)
So it's just mind boggling to me and like something I struggle with because I see a lot of times on the internet, know, people are like, it's a red state. They voted for this and like, yes, Lawrence County is red and the adults voted for it. But even if the adults voted for it, the children are being negatively impacted. Teachers are being negatively

impacted. And we already in South Carolina have a teacher shortage crisis. Like, I mean, I'm sure it's like everywhere. ⁓ But like, underpaid, I mean, I can't remember. I don't want to misquote, but I think it was the 2023 to 2024 school year, it was like 2000 vacancies across the state for teachers. So like, we need programs like this, like initiatives that will help

provide better training for teachers, help retain them, help fund their salaries, help promote better education in our children. And because, and I don't know why I haven't been able to find out like what specifically, but in reality, there's probably nothing specific that makes this grant DEI. It's probably because maybe it's a county that is lower income, for example, and the administration views that as.

Inclusion. I don't I don't know the specifics, but that was a big thing here I haven't seen as much as it sounds like you have Britt and that my kids aren't in public school yet because they're still in preschool daycare ⁓ But I know that was a big thing that happened here once all of this transpired

Chelsea Myers (19:24)
Can we talk for a second about what DEI actually is? that, mean, because a lot of this episode is probably gonna focus on DEI, even though there's a lot of layers to all of this, but DEI, the narrative, the narrative is just like Britt was saying, is like it's discriminating against children and people who are white because we're giving it.

The thought is that schools are giving more opportunities or more accommodations to students from diverse backgrounds.

Britt (19:59)
And a lot

of this too falls on that there is a, that there's a lowering of standards for people of those minority, I hate minority, sorry, marginalized population, ⁓ marginalized populations because somehow we're allowing people of those marginalized populations to have lower standards to get into these programs or

Chelsea Myers (20:06)
Yes.

Britt (20:28)
positions or schools or whatever.

Chelsea Myers (20:32)
which is not DEI. ⁓ Let's be 100 % clear, that's not what DEI is. ⁓ Putting it in terms that are easy for us to understand as moms and as parents, DEI means that there's a ramp for your kid who uses a wheelchair to get into the school. DEI means that your student who is on the autism spectrum or may have Down syndrome,

is getting specialized services so that they can access their education. DEI is having someone scribe if you have challenges with writing. DEI is making programs accessible and let's use the word equity. It's not a, I loved, I love this. I'm sure everybody has heard this.

But one of my favorite kindergarten teachers that I used to work with would do the difference between equity and equality. it's kids standing at a fence trying to see a baseball game. And I love it. And equality is all three kids getting a step stool that's the same size, but those three kids aren't the same height, so they can't see the game. Equity is every kid getting a step stool the size that they need so that they can see the game. DEI.

makes it so that everyone can access the same thing.

Britt (21:55)
We did I taught my kids about equity using the elbow on the band-aid story. Have any of you ever heard of this story? ⁓ So it's like okay if you were to trip and fall and you fell down and You skinned your elbow, right? And you said mom I need a band-aid and so I gave you a band-aid for your elbow Then say why it was Reno skipping and she fell and she scraped her knee Well, if I was trying to be fair, I make sure to give you both the same thing and I put

bandaid on her elbow so it was the same, then does her need get met? Okay, so say Nico is skipping and he trips and he falls and he skins his shin. Again, if I'm trying to be fair and I gave him the same thing, a bandaid on his elbow, it wouldn't meet his need. And so it's essentially it's using and ensuring that everybody's still getting a bandaid, everybody's still getting the

basic of what they need in that moment, but equity is tailoring how that bandaid or where that bandaid goes to ensure that everybody is getting their needs met, even if we're all getting some sort of support. And I think a lot of people forget that diversity, equity and inclusion is allowing and ensuring that everybody is getting

those additional supports, right? It's not taking support away from any one person or another, but it's seeing that other people need support in different areas and in different ways, and that we're meeting those needs across the board. And in no way, I don't know why there is such a lack of like an abundance mindset, like these supports or, ⁓

that are some way taking away from another person, when in reality it's just adjusting the support that exists to better serve everyone. ⁓ And really, I think the lack of an abundance mindset is one of the things that drives capitalism so well, That demand that, it's hard to get, so it's worth more money and things like that, that really drives the foundational principles. It thrives on

assuming that there is a lack of, for other people and that if you're taking away from those who have more, you're taking away from them versus instead of just adjusting those resources. So I think diversity, equity and inclusion so often gets this bad name of it's somehow making it easier for people of less deserving to survive or thrive when in reality that's

It's making it easier for everyone to thrive.

Chelsea Myers (24:47)
I really want to hear from Lindsay and Midori too, like just what your thoughts are or what you're seeing in your school districts.

Lindsey Basler (24:55)
Yeah, I was about to jump in right before we were talking more about specifically what DEI is and just sort of jumping in when Jess was talking about the teacher shortage. ⁓ I too, like you Chelsea, was a teacher before. I think we both have some experience in special education and I am a caregiver for my niece that has Down syndrome. So I kind of see it in from the teacher aspect and then as a parent in some regard. ⁓

who is parenting someone with disabilities. And I live outside of the school district that my niece attends right now where all of our families live, but we're possibly moving back to that area. And just recently, they're just a real world example. I am wondering if they just had a vote on if they would increase ⁓ their teacher pay and

do some long-term bigger steps on their pay scale and really if they were gonna invest in the teachers that they have and their new teachers that were coming in. I really wonder if our entire political climate would have been different. They got a no. their community said no, we are not supporting you basically. And the really unfortunate part is only, I think it was 11%, I might.

It might be a little more, a little less, but it was under 15%. I know for sure of the entire community of voters even showed up. But those teachers got told, no, I know there were a lot of heartbroken teachers the next day. But I know they showed up to work and they did what they do every day. They showed up to work and they did their best. ⁓ But I really wanna know if we had a different climate if their

community would have showed up for them better and said, you know, we're investing in you and we want to stand up when everybody else in the entire country, our president is trying to shut you down and say, you know, there's not much, you know, on that level that I can do at this exact moment, but I can, you know, put my vote into at least paying you more to keep doing what you're doing for our community. So that was a really sad example of something that just happened in my hometown community. And then just seeing,

The way that, well, our, what is her name? Our WWE SmackDown lady.

Chelsea Myers (27:25)
Something McMahon.

Lindsey Basler (27:27)
Yes.

Britt (27:28)
something

secretary of something.

Lindsey Basler (27:28)
Yes. I, before we got on was just reviewing a letter that the National Congress for Down Syndrome had sent out just regarding a lot of issues specifically for Department of Education and you know how she's gone on national news, not even knowing what certain acronyms stand for and just seeing that and then being

Chelsea Myers (27:30)
Yeah.

Lindsey Basler (27:53)
It was right around that time that my niece had an IEP meeting and she is someone who absolutely hates school. So I go into her IEP meeting like I know a lot of parents do and I'm like, I am ready to like fight you. Like I know we should all be on the same side, but I am like ready for a battle, but I'm like, who, what's behind me now? Like what, so if this is how it already was, how much worse can it get when I'm like,

I don't even have a Department of Education to stand behind me and uphold any of these policies and ensure that she is getting her needs met. ⁓ I personally, when I was in special education, the program that I worked for in a bigger city closer to St. Louis was incredible. We had so many supports. There are like six adults working with a lot of children that had multiple needs and it was incredible seeing.

all of the funding that they had to support all of these kids and then going to our the smaller town where she's at and just seeing the huge difference in programs and this is in the last couple of years not even what it's going to look like in the future.

So that is where we are.

Britt (29:09)
Yeah, I think it'll be interesting. My kids have medical needs and so like they use like the IEP system for like their medical stuff. So my kids don't have education needs that well one of mine does but most of like my kids have G tubes or feeding tubes and need blood sugar monitoring sometimes when they're not feeling well and so like their IEP states there has to be

somebody on staff at the school that can do those kinds of monitoring. ⁓ Because in our school districts here in Oklahoma, they'll have one nurse for the entire school district and they will like rotate and then otherwise there's no nurse at the school unless there's like an emergency, which is just crazy to me. Or sometimes they'll have like, yeah, so they'll only be there a few days a week. And so.

What's crazy is that, you know, this dismantling of these programs, it's impacting kids with educational needs as far as like support goes between like PT, OT programs. Most people don't realize that like your early programs like ours is here, the Sooner Start program, right? It's like the kids who are at risk for developmental delays and things early, early, ⁓ they can start getting therapies. Like our preemie babies will start getting therapies.

second they get home from the NICU to ensure that they have development. But after about age four, or it's after age three, the education, like the public school system takes over all of those. And so they will then get their speech, OT, ⁓ therapies all at the actual public schools. And so these are the programs that are going to be losing this funding and dismantling its kids that are on various sides of

spectrum of needs and support and overall it's going to make those kids that maybe weren't diagnosed until they get into school less likely to get the support they need. It just, I just, as somebody who has kids in the public school system, I just don't see how any of these programs are absolutely and actually supporting ensuring that our kids are all getting access to an education.

Chelsea Myers (31:24)
Midori, do you homeschool? Do I remember that you homeschool? Yeah, so does this impact homeschooling at all though?

Midori (31:27)
Yeah.

Well, I'm in Illinois, so yes, because they want to regulate homeschooling more, which is fascinating because it's like, well, it's just fascinating to me because as some homeschools my kids, it's like, we're still paying whatever money we get to pay, which we have no issue with, obviously, and we don't access, we aren't utilizing the things that...

are being offered, is totally, that's like fine. And, but now they want to like come into like what we're doing, right? Like we're doing all the things that we're supposed to be doing and like regulate all these things within what we're educating our kids. And it's just so that to me, it's like mind blowing. I'm like, this is, this is crazy because we're not like, we're now going to be affected by something that we actually have nothing to do with.

And so from that standpoint, it's like, it's really hard to like, yeah, like, and I think so it's like the overcorrection, right? Like, I think, I don't think why I can't speak for everyone, but I think the majority of people probably weren't fully happy with how the Department of Education was operating. And now like they're, and so like, there's just, here I am, like, we just got to like, mash them together. Like there's pros from how it was operating. And I'm sure there's pros of how it's.

Britt (32:32)
It's government overreach. It's government overreach.

Midori (32:55)
can currently operate, like they just, it's just like one pendulum swing to the next. So like now it's just creating more divisiveness in the whole big picture of like what it is and really like the majority of people that are getting injured is like the next generation. Like it's our kids who are being affected. And so I think from that standpoint, it's like really difficult. I don't have like the same like day-to-day experiences with as like what you guys have shared because I don't have kids in the school, in the public school system. And like we live in a,

good school system. like we do like a bunch of my daughter's friends like go to the public school. So like we get invited to a lot of their things like recently we went to this like multicultural thing that like the I don't know it was like a fest where everyone like made food from their country. And I was talking to one of they worked for the school. I'm not really sure they did but they like

were some sort of they were like a teacher they like worked in the administration and they actually said that this was like a state thing that they're implementing to implementing for all of the Illinois public schools that they're like requiring these things so from like a culture standpoint I thought that was like really cool but have like I mean it just it's crazy I just think the

Dismantling of anything to its fullest degree is wild. And I think that our Department of Education was built centuries ago. And it hasn't improved. It hasn't improved and it hasn't improved. We're still working off of old philosophies that have changed. When it was first started, it was to serve the immigrant families that needed to work. So they needed a place to put their kids while they were at work.

Right? Like that's like part of the basis of why the public education system was built because immigrants would come over and they needed to put their kids somewhere. And so it became this, whether we disagree or agree on this, it became like a childcare for kids and while they were in this place. And so I feel like our education system creates employees. And so like it takes away, I feel like it also strips away creativity from our kids. So I feel like there's that end of the Department of Education where I'm like, yeah, that could be improved. Like, I don't think that we need to.

I don't think, regardless of race, sex, whatever, don't believe that all kids learn, develop, at the exact same age. And so I think from that perspective, think that's an opportunity that the Department of Education gets to shift. And so I think putting my six year old in a class with another six year old would be unfair to both sides. It's gonna be unfair to my six year old because she's...

more advanced and it's going to be unfair to the person who is a six year old and they're operating in like the normal scale, whatever it is, because they're just not the same. And so I think we just try and put boxes around your this race, this sex, this age, you do this, you're this, And it's like, well, Bill, like everybody is so different. And so my issue with the Department of Education now, then whatever is like

You just can't put like those massive group of individuals in a box and expect this extremely successful outcome. So I feel like it's like more individualized like time and which now I'm stripping all these things obviously takes more individualized time away because of everything you guys are mentioning like scarcity of teachers. But then that's a whole different thing or a whole nother thing. Cause like in Chicago or in Illinois of like you talk about Chicago, they get billions.

like billions of dollars of federal funding. And we have a very, very low success rate for the children. So it's like, I don't know if more money is actually going to get like the kids like going to move the needle. Like they've increasingly got more money. And it's not like, like you would think you get more money, more kids are going to do better, right? Like it's like a stepping stone, but it's like not like they get more money and like kids get worse. They get more money and kids get worse. So it's like, I don't think throwing money at everything is a solution either.

Britt (36:59)
Okay, so this brought me up because I was interested. I love that we, these notes are great. So I was reading, I went down to our notes. ⁓ Chelsea did an incredible job, by the way, of putting these notes together. was Jess the one who did this one?

Midori (37:09)
I agree.

Chelsea Myers (37:10)
was just gonna, well, Jess, I want you, well, no, Jess did,

Jess added, and I was like, can we please talk about this? Jess added what the Department of Education actually does and what they don't do, yes.

Britt (37:20)
Yeah, so that's I was gonna jump to this.

Yeah, so, okay, so thanks, Jess, then, I apologize. Jess, thanks so much for putting this up. So I wanted to jump to this, like the actual history of the Department of Education. ⁓ So this is new information for me, to be perfectly honest. Like I'm learning as I'm going over this, so I'm not coming from a place of like, I knew all these things, but I didn't.

Jess Rabon (she/her) (37:29)
You're welcome.

Britt (37:47)
So anyways, the Department of Education's origins go back to 1867 when President Andrew Johnson signed legislation creating the first Department of Education and its main purpose was to collect information and statistics about the nation's schools. However, due to concern that the department would exercise too much control over local schools, the new department was demoted to an Office of Education in 1868.

So beginning in the 1950s was when the political and social changes resulted in expanded federal funding for education. And the successful launch of the Soviet Union's Sputnik in 1957 spurred nationwide concern that led to increased aid for science education programs. ⁓

The 1960s saw even more expansion of the federal education funding when President Lyndon Johnson's war on poverty called for the creation of many programs to improve education for poor students at all levels, which was early childhood through post-secondary. So this expansion continued in the 1970s with national efforts to help racial minorities, women,

people with disabilities and non-English speaking students gain access or equal access to education. In October of 1979, Congress passed the Department of Education Organization Act, which was combining offices from several federal agencies and the department actually only began operations in May of 1980.

The Department of Education is actually just an agency of the federal government that establishes policies for admin and administers and coordinates most of the federal assistance to education. So it assists the presidents in executing his education policies for the nation and in implementing laws enacted by Congress. So the department's mission is actually to serve American students.

to promote student achievement and preparation for global competitiveness by fostering educational excellence and ensuring equal access.

Chelsea Myers (40:14)
Let's talk about how yucky that sounds, first of all. ⁓ When I read that, I was like, ew, yuck. So just ⁓ part of it, yuck, not the whole thing, yuck.

Britt (40:16)
Yeah.

Yeah,

no. I actually thought the history was really interesting. I didn't know really the underlying start of when it was. you know, so to actually like think and look back that really the Department of Education really only started in 1980. This isn't something that's been around long term. Before that, there was an office of that was kind of using it sounds more like for statistic management and

starting yeah but that was really it sounds like up until you know the 1970s 1980s when then it became

Midori (41:03)
No, it was

definitely used for more than just statistics when it first started. I don't have the, there definitely was used for more than just statistics. was, it was used to like filter kids. Like there's both and.

Chelsea Myers (41:16)
think they said that.

yes. Well, so it started. Yeah. No, it's so like when Andrew Johnson initially signed the thing to begin with, it was just to collect information, I think. And I think that does speak to what you're saying, Midori, too. Like it wasn't just like collecting educational statistics. It was like demographics and

Britt (41:21)
If you can find like a resource, I would be really interested in seeing that.

Midori (41:24)
Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (41:46)
Like, yeah, everybody's like, we're nationalities and things like that. ⁓

Britt (41:51)
Yeah,

I mean, we did say to that due to the concern that that department would exercise too much control. That's why the department was actually demoted to the Office of Education in 1868. So it was only actually a department for one year until there were concerns that it would be exercising too much control. And so then it was just demoted.

Chelsea Myers (42:14)
So it's been in flux. It was in flux, but then the Department of Education, not as we know it today, but let's say a year ago, the Department of Education as we knew it last year really only was established in 1980. That I do it like we're all taught that what educators are taught that. ⁓ But to go deeper than that and so that we can be like real real.

Like what the Department of Education actually does, the federal Department of Education, not your state Department of Education, and what it doesn't do. I want to talk about what it doesn't do first. Thank you, Jess. Because so many people think that this is what the federal Department of Education does, and it does not. It does not establish schools and colleges. It does not develop curricula. It does not.

set requirements for enrollment or graduation. It doesn't determine state education standards. So the standards, the things that are being taught in your schools are not being decided by the federal government. And it does not develop or implement testing to measure whether states are meeting their educational standards. Those are done at the state level. So what they do do, I'm not going to read that do do.

poop. yeah, I'm gonna summarize, but, ⁓ it's used to strengthen federal commitment to ensuring equal access to education. Equal, we know, isn't a great term, but that's how it is worded.

Britt (43:42)
Heheh, dirty.

Chelsea Myers (43:58)
supplement and complement the efforts of the states does that. Encourages increased involvement of the public, which means parents and students in federal education programs. It wants to bring parents in.

Promote improvements in the quality and usefulness of education through federally supported research. So they do research. Improve coordination of federal education programs. These are federal education programs. And improve management and efficiency of federal education activities, especially with respect to process procedures and administrative structures for this

the dispersal of federal funds. can't speak today. And it's also just to increase the accountability of federal education programs ⁓ to the president, the Congress, and the public. That is what it does do. That can be very confusing.

Britt (44:56)
And it does oversee federal loans, student loans, federal loans for lower income students, special education programs, and all of those as well. So it does oversee quite a bunch of funding, but it doesn't, the Department of Education actually doesn't, that's where, you know, earlier when I said that the whole push for this agenda of dismantling the Department of Education was to return it back to the states. But that's,

Chelsea Myers (44:58)
Yes.

Which is right.

Britt (45:25)
it was already in access to the states. The Department of Education was never put in to develop any type of curricula or education standards. All of our state testing, like my fifth grader just had state testing the last two weeks. All of those standardized testings are all dependent on individual state standards. And so I think that's where the confusion has come from.

like in my opinion, as all of these people who were like, ⁓ you know, we were pro-dismantling the Department of Education because we want to ensure that they're not teaching things to our kids in schools. Anything that your kid is actually learning in school, the individual, and that's how things like Oklahoma is now starting to put the Bible in our schools, you know, and that's not a federally mandated thing because curricula,

and state expectations come from your individual state superintendent, which is why I wanted to turn back to Lindsay's point on how important voting in local elections is and how important voter turnout is. Because even when we're looking at, I saw this ⁓ infographic earlier and it was like only 30 % of the entire population of the United States voted for Donald Trump. There was no majority.

30 % voted for elsewhere and 36 % of Americans didn't vote. More Americans didn't vote at all than Americans voted for Donald Trump. Yet now we are all stuck under this insane level of like, whatever. And here in Oklahoma, that's where you're not seeing your kids improve. That's coming from, okay, who have you voted for in your state superintendent?

who is actually determining the curriculum that's being taught in these schools, where is the funding being funneled through? And all of that is returned to your state superintendent. That's where in Oklahoma, we can now restrict federal funds from independent school districts. That is coming from our state because all of the federal funding goes through your single portion. So if you're not happy with how your school state

program is running, what supports are involved in your schools, that is 100 % a local election process that you're not participating in. And if the crackdown on homeschooling and things like that, that all comes from the state superintendent of education. And that is an electable place and an electable seat in your government. And so.

This dismantling of the department has been so wild because these things that they say they're going to do, ensuring that everybody's on the right curriculum, that we're improving testing scores, those things, none of that is even regulated by the federal government. None of it.

Chelsea Myers (48:30)
Yeah, go Jess.

Jess Rabon (she/her) (48:31)
I want to go back to a few things Midori was saying because I think one thing you said, Midori, and I'm probably going to like screw up your words, like, you know, going back to its intents versus where we are now, I completely agree with you that like dismantling anything in totality is like not the answer. And my mindset when I hear all about this and I know there's plans, oh, we'll put this funding here, this funding here. You know, if the department began in what we know it is today, 45 years ago,

Let's go back to what the initial intent were, go through those like seven purposes, which ones are working, which ones aren't. How can we address maybe the ones that aren't working rather than completely deconstructing the entire thing with initially concepts of a plan, now maybe some more solidified plan. Because I think an overhaul

without a plan or complete dismantling without a plan is going to do more harm than good. But I have no problem personally, and people can disagree, doing a deep dive looking at, what's working, what's not? How can we address the parts that aren't working? ⁓ Whether that is from a funding standpoint, whether that's from, you you hear people talk all the time, and I know Britt, you just kind of talked about this. ⁓

how education test scores haven't gotten better, it does go down back to the state level. One of my favorite questions to ask online, which I never get legitimate answers to, is what is the Department of Education currently doing that you are excited for to be turned over to the states? Because there's never an answer, because the things like curriculum and things like that already are on the state level.

⁓ so I think from my perspective, I mean, I have concerns with this dismantling, but I have also no problem with us looking at what the department of education is doing. What is working? What's not? Let's go back to those goals from 45 years ago, because we live in completely different times. Do we need to update, modify, change what those goals are? Maybe we do eliminate some, maybe we've

find, okay, we're gathering statistics, but what are we doing with those statistics? Do we need to gather different? But in my opinion, just dismantling the whole thing is not, especially without a plan, is not the answer.

Chelsea Myers (51:05)
It's creating chaos, but at the same time, what's so baffling and confusing to me, and I would love everybody else's opinions, is like, yes, we're talking about the dismantling of the Department of Education and what that's gonna mean. And ⁓ side note, this is happening to almost every branch of government right now or every governmental department right now. So it's not just the Department of Ed. But anyway, we'll talk about that in a later episode. ⁓

Yes, so they're saying they're dismantling and giving power back to the states while also pushing initiatives of putting the Bibles back in schools, which I believe in freedom of religion. And yeah, like that's fine. we were founded on the separation of church and state. so choosing one religion and pushing that into the school system isn't the answer either. But

So we're seeing that, we're seeing schools being.

Britt (52:06)
I would love

to do an episode on the ⁓ new anti-Christian discrimination task force.

Chelsea Myers (52:12)
Yeah, we and we talked about that. Midori

actually asked if we could do an episode on that. So we should do an episode on that. but so while they're dismantling the Department of Education with with no plan, they're also you're also hearing Trump say he can't actually do this, by the way, but saying like, we're to put the Bible back in schools, we're going to put like, you have to say the Pledge of Allegiance, you have to like, and also taking DEI out of schools.

Britt (52:16)
Yes, I would love to because that's crazy.

Chelsea Myers (52:40)
So you're saying that you're getting rid of this department while also saying, no, but we're still in charge of this and you have to do this. We don't have that department anymore.

Britt (52:49)
and the things that he's saying

they're in charge of were never what that department was in charge of.

Chelsea Myers (52:53)
They were never in charge of

them. And, and I don't know how much trouble this is going to get me into. Britt has brought up a couple of times now that the Department of Education does oversee student loans. And they are in the process of transferring those student loans to a different department of the government, which breaches our contract.

You... yeah. It breaches the contracts that we all signed when we went to college and makes them null and void, which means we do not need to pay them. My husband and I...

Britt (53:18)
I really want to do this.

Chelsea Myers (53:32)
You've heard me talk about this before. You've heard me talk about this before. We live in unprecedented times. are. We're working on one income. We're not in the situation that we were in 10 years ago. Our finances. Are sacred and we have to use them to feed our family and to clothe our family.

And if you're going to breach a contract, like we've had lawyers say this, like, if it truly does breach our contract, which it sounds like it does, we're not doing anything yet. But we are seriously considering not paying our student loans. And I think they know that that's what we're going to do. And that's why they're saying that now they're going to garnish our wages and they're going to do that. But I don't think they have the grounds to do it. ⁓ this is not legal advice. I am not a lawyer.

I don't know enough about this, but I do know for a fact that if they transfer our loans to a different department, it breaches our contract.

It just pisses me off. It's like, just do it. Do it.

Britt (54:35)
Yep, I know I was seeing,

I think I saw, did I see that like one Instagram reel I found to you about how like if you go on and there's something that you can do online where you literally dispute your student loans and

Chelsea Myers (54:48)
yeah, and

they'll just be like, okay, fine, nevermind. So please don't take this as legal advice. Please don't. But, but keep your ear like to the right sources and keep your eyes out and know your rights because if they do do this, it really does technically breach our contract. Whether or not that gives us the grounds to stop paying is muddy. ⁓

Britt (54:51)
I know, I think I'm gonna go do that. I'll keep everybody updated if it actually works. Absolutely not.

Chelsea Myers (55:14)
but part of me really wants them to just do it. Like, just fucking do it. Do it.

Britt (55:19)
And that's,

think the one thing that like, least we have going, you know, with this nightmare of an administration as at least I don't, I don't think they actually have any idea of like the legal ramp, like the legal battles and how that is going to impact a lot. And I think it's, unfortunately, it's going to take, there, there's so many issues and ongoing legal battles that are now really impacting

you know, the transformation of way things are. And you can't just pick a department that has, you know, taken care of millions of trillions of dollars. I think, what did they say? The student debt load right now is like $1.6 trillion or something. It was a lot when I was reading last. That you can't just determine to switch that now with those people own money to somebody else. It's not legal. You can't do that. I think it's really interesting.

wanted to go back to our because Jess said a really interesting thing, you know, about executing budget cuts. And, you know, this has all been part of, you know, Elon Musk's Department of Government Efficiency or DOGE as they're calling it and how I think so many people on both sides of the political spectrum are so for the

actual looking into funds and where they're going. And I don't think, I think for many people, that's not a concern. The concern is how it's going. And for me specifically with, you know, budget cuts and the department of education and all of that, the talks that there has been use of AI to identify and eliminate what it is determining as non-essential spending is concerning because

I think the one thing that gives us humanhood and our humanness is our understanding of that and not knowing that everything is ⁓ a gray scale of yes and no. And I think when you are starting to get AI involved to look through these programs, there's so much gray area into where things and how money is actually being spent that I think so many of us are pro the

evaluation of where funds is going. ⁓ But I think what scares a lot of us, me included, is the fact of how that's being done. And this dismantling ⁓ is a civil rights issue, honestly.

Lindsey Basler (57:50)
And kind of with what, ⁓ I was gonna make a comment on what Jess said also, and you made a good point there too, Britt, is that the dismantling and re-looking at things is not necessarily a problem. It's the not having a plan and not having people doing it who are professionals and experts that have the knowledge to look at it, not using AI to look at this budget, using people that are

working in said field every single day. even if this, I mean, this is not an answer. This is years and years of work and, you know, tons of people to do it, but having the Department of Education even setting up a plan for each of those individual school districts, looking at where their funds are going. know just, just, I mean, I'm sure this is a problem in a lot of places, but

I just go back to the same school district ⁓ that I have the most experience with and people having problems where they're putting a lot of funding towards sports and not getting textbooks or things like that. just, you know, that's, boils down to those smaller levels, not that they're funding DEI programs and ⁓ funding programs to be more inclusive. It's that once schools are getting that money and our states are

the ones controlling that, then where is it going after that? you know, people who don't work in education and AI doesn't know how to assess those funds and where we need to put them. And like we've all said, you know, we don't have, no one has a perfect answer, but looking and using, I think, professionals is a better start than where we've started.

Britt (59:41)
Yeah, I think, you know, here in Oklahoma, like, I'm like, why aren't we looking at where this information is like where this money is going? Like we have a lot of charter schools, for-profit charter schools in our area. We have a very large voucher program. Like I kind of talked in the beginning where now our funds are being diverted to private schools that are already charging people twenty thousand dollars a year to attend. Why are those? What are those private schools doing with

their funding and money already, that now they are needing additional federal funds. And on our little notes here was privatized online learning opportunities too. Now there are even like federally ⁓ recognized, you know, high school programs, online programs where students are actually having to not show up or do a lot.

And there's no accountability to what is being taught. And so the federal funding issue, think, I can say pretty much all of us agree that we are for the evaluation of where funds are going, for sure. But this is definitely not the way to do it.

Chelsea Myers (1:00:54)
No.

Midori (1:00:54)
And just

real quick about the local government thing. Although the local government thing doesn't, although the Department of Education doesn't directly affect it, it is an overflow of it. So like I actually am really good friends with a lot of people in our local government. Well, the handful of ones that would affect my, the area that we live in. And when the homeschooling thing went into effect, or like the vote, got shut down like before, and then it got re-brought up because of the

because of how aggressive they went at, because of how aggressive federal government went after the Department of Education, the local government matched their aggressiveness for the homeschooling stuff. So although it is a directly, like the Department of Education did directly affect the day to day, it indirectly does. So to say that they're completely separate, they have nothing to do with it is not true. And I've literally had phone calls with local governments being like, this is crazy. and so, so yes, I agree. And it's

it's not completely disconnected to the degree that I feel like it's being communicated here because there is there is a connection point.

Chelsea Myers (1:01:59)
glad that you brought that up. I am glad that you brought that up. And again, we're gonna get to our hot take here in just a second. But I just want to like validate what you're saying because I know that I got kind of hot too when I was talking about what it does and what it doesn't do. And I think, my gosh, but

Midori (1:02:14)
Which I totally appreciate and I understand. And to

like, but to say they're completely disconnected, everything in government is connected. Like, so does that, yes, that's true. but as we have all experienced, like if it was just that black and white, it would be much easier to like make decisions and like have clarity. But because we are in, because everyone I feel like is living in such a gray area of like what's actually happening, what's not. There's like so much.

Chelsea Myers (1:02:19)
Yeah.

Yes.

Midori (1:02:42)
really what it comes down to is there's this like trust breakdown, right? Like if we all trusted leadership, there would be a much more black and white, like, okay, I don't fully agree with this, but I can see where you're going and I trust you enough to make the right decision. But because there's just such a massive trust breakdown, it creates like such a divisiveness. So that we literally flounder for four years and get nowhere. And then we get to start from wherever the mess is in four years with a new administration.

Chelsea Myers (1:03:07)
No, I'm glad that you said it. I think,

Midori (1:03:08)
Here we are.

Britt (1:03:10)
Well, and I want to say too,

like, I completely agree with that. I want you because like, because one, mean, and I think there's such a political like our political superintendent or our state superintendent is so politically pulled into, you know, it is so heavily politicized. It is so heavily driven by money, private money and where things are going. And, and it is so very, it is more interconnected than it should be. And I don't think anybody is

Chelsea Myers (1:03:14)
Yes.

Britt (1:03:39)
denying that. And I think everybody is agreeing that evaluation needs to occur. But it should be occurring, like Lindsay said, with professionals who are living in that, and working in it actively, and not an AI of a guy who's probably never even volunteered at one of his like 17 million children's schools. Like, can you imagine Elon Musk showing up to like a PTA car wash? Absolutely not. So like, why are we letting this guy AI run?

dismantling of a department that impacts millions and millions of people across the United States wild. Okay, let's get to our hot take.

Chelsea Myers (1:04:16)
Okay, I love you. want to ⁓ clarify because I did, I screwed up. That's what the Department of Education, the federal Department of Education is supposed to do. That's what it was designed to do, not what it's doing, but that's what it was designed to do. And so what it was designed to do and what it was not designed to do. So clarification, but guess what? We're starting a new segment and it is called Hot Takes. And if you follow us, which you should be,

on Instagram or threads and YouTube and I think that's all where we are right now. ⁓ We always want to hear from you and we ask some pretty awesome questions and we've been getting some pretty awesome answers. So this week's hot take came from Instagram and we wanted to know what your unpopular parenting opinion was. Jess got some awesome responses.

And so the hot take we chose is that schools fall under the umbrella of childcare. And of everyone that responded, 34 % of responders agreed, 41 % of responders disagreed, and 24 % of responders says it depends on the age. I would love to hear first from Midori and Lindsay.

how you guys feel about this hot take because you know me, Jess and Britt can get hot. I want to hear how you feel about this hot take.

Lindsey Basler (1:05:44)
you

So I, this is not a black and white answer. If I had to give you a black and white answer, my answer would be no. But if I could continue on that, my answer to are teachers babysitters? Absolutely not. ⁓ I have taught from kindergarten to high school, and I can say I felt like a babysitter many times. I was paid less than a babysitter. Did I want to be a babysitter? I did not. So no.

from the parenting aspect, I feel like my answer is maybe, is probably a little privileged in that I can see where you do not have a community or a village, you need to consider school as part of your childcare umbrella. this is a big umbrella, then I can feel like it is a yes. Like you,

I mean, you have to have a place for your children to go while you are working. but you still have to realize that if things happen and there is not school that you have to have a backup plan. So I feel like, no, it cannot be your only 100%. This is where my children will be going here in Missouri. I mean, we have snow days. That's pretty much the only time that we're not having school.

And you see the continuous battles of, they should have had school today. There's only seven inches of snow. They could have made it. And it's like, it's an impossible decision to make. ⁓ And it's your job as a parent to have a backup plan. I know that is impossible for a lot of people to have an option A, B and C, but we have to have it. But then again, we get into the idea of

We don't give any support for people to have an A, B and C. So from, I see it more from my teacher aspect of, was I a babysitter? Absolutely not. ⁓ Was I there to babysit your children? No, I was there to help educate them and help them grow as human beings and love them. Was I there to just make sure they didn't die? I mean, essentially no, but yes, I would do that too. ⁓

So gosh, it is just such a hard yes or no. I would probably be in the it depends category. ⁓ For my teacher aspect, no. From thinking of all the parents out there, probably more agree.

Chelsea Myers (1:08:24)
Where do you fall, Midori?

Midori (1:08:25)
I just don't even...

It's just a lot. It's just, yeah.

Lindsey Basler (1:08:31)
It's sort of an impossible, impossible question to answer fully.

Midori (1:08:36)
I feel like it's like a both and I don't my kids aren't in school, so I don't feel like it's like a fair.

like thing I think my friends who have children in school, like appreciate that they can go somewhere that it's already paid for, you know, but, there's a benefit of them being educated. I probably don't, I just probably don't value the education system in the same degree that others do or do not, whatever. So.

Like my whole goal is to get my kids to take their GED as early as possible so we can be done with it. So like, I don't know. It's hard for me to answer. Cause again, like I want my kid out of this school system as quickly as possible, regardless of what's going on with the Department of Education, regardless of what's going on with your state. I just want them to have the freedom to.

be like, yeah, and they may not make as much money as like an educated person or they may not, they may, they may make more money than education. Like those things don't matter to me. I just want them to be able to like do what they're like put on this, put on this earth to do. So we don't utilize the school system. And so I think it's not a fair, I don't think I'm like, I don't think it's fair for me to respond because yeah.

I'm not the parent who's gonna drop your kid off at 6 a.m., have him go to school all day, and then do an after-school program. And I get that those are the options, that's the only options some people have. And I would probably adjust my lifestyle and my job or career to accommodate keeping my kids home before I would send them to school. So I guess my answer would disagree.

Chelsea Myers (1:09:49)
I think that's valid!

or it depends. Yeah, but okay, but I wanted to, I wanted to, like you were saying, like you're, you're educating your children. You are, you're just not using the public education system. Like you kept saying, like, they may not have the same opportunities as educating. You're educating your kids and you're doing it in the, yeah.

Midori (1:10:18)
Or is it fun?

Yeah, well yeah, behind the back.

Britt (1:10:33)
And I have my GED by the way and have multiple

college degrees and was able to do whatever I wanted. Yeah. Yeah. I dropped out in 10th grade. I'm like...

Midori (1:10:40)
Exactly, that's I'm like just go get your GED when you're like 12 years old or however old you want to be. Yeah,

Chelsea Myers (1:10:41)
Yes!

Midori (1:10:45)
it's like people I yeah, there's so many like I'd rather be like Play in the grass go get your GED when you want to and then figure and like then we can like have a yeah, we'll just

Britt (1:10:55)
Yeah. I will say though too, so can I go mine? Because I'm a single mom and like, you know, it is a different, I will say like on the weeks that I have my kids, like my youngest is four, right? So we had the option, the last two previous years we had paid for a private nanny, but I was married and I had two incomes and I was able to afford that kind of situation to keep him out of a daycare.

Chelsea Myers (1:10:55)
I love it. Okay. Yeah, please. Yeah.

Britt (1:11:23)
And when he turned four, you know, we had the I had the opportunity to decide if I was going to send him through our like pre-K Head Start program through our public school system or if I was going to have to send him back to daycare because I can't afford to not work as a single parent during the weeks that I have them. And so ⁓ we actually chose to put him in the pre-K program through the the public school system. And all of my kids are in public school.

And like I very much would say that like I do count on the public school system and hours that they are at school to be able to work. Like I my work schedule is I work 1030 to three on the weeks that I have them. So that way I don't have to pay for child care ⁓ because if I had to pay for child care during the day, even for just my son, it would significantly reduce how much I'm actually able to bring home. ⁓ And so in that

Yes, I do rely on my children being able to attend school every day from nine to three thirty to be able to like afford my life. However, I also have a very flexible lifestyle and have made it to where like I own my own private practice during the week. So even on the weeks that I'm working, if my kid has to stay home from school or things like that, I can very much easily move my clients or my day around ⁓ to be able to accommodate their schedule. And so.

in that like I really can identify with what I Lindsay said is like yes I do rely on it as a form of child care are my children there as a daycare no but I think that in my opinion public school really allows my children to learn how to interact and work and create with people on all levels of a spectrum that they would not get

from a homeschool situation. And for me, as somebody who works very much in my community and heavily relies on my ability to interact with other people and to be able to empathize with people on various levels, like for me, public school, I don't rely on public school as the only form of education for my children, but I do very much see it as a way for my children to be exposed to people on all different life spectrums ⁓ and to be able to like,

co-create and work and be involved in that. And so, yes, I use it as a form of childcare. I also don't rely on it as my only form of childcare. And I don't believe that they are babysitters. And I think that there's a big benefit of public schools for my children and what I want them to accommodate and learn how to do in their life. And so I am very much in an it's depends situation.

over here because I kind of see all of the sides and I if I had the ability to stay home with my kids and homeschool them and was able to like provide that education I would absolutely pull them from the public school system and put them in homeschool co-ops and things like that in order to get that like I think that is a very

viable option of education and don't think that not going to public school is going to make it so your kid can't cohabitate with other people. I want that to be very clear. ⁓ I also think that I physically cannot afford to do that. So I think it's different strokes for different folks. What works best for your life is going to work best for you. And that is what works best for me in my life.

Chelsea Myers (1:15:02)
Do want to answer, Jess? okay.

Jess Rabon (she/her) (1:15:03)
I'll just

add that, because I think what Lindsay said kind of mostly aligns with my thought process, like looking at it. So I'm definitely, it depends. I would say where I lean more to yes, and this might just be my phase of life I'm in, is when they are younger. So like my kids are in quote unquote daycare, but it's a preschool that has a curriculum from.

six weeks, all my kids didn't go out six weeks. So like, and granted, I recognize my privilege because we pay a lot of money for them to go to this educational program, but it is also a daycare. So do I view the educational program my children are currently in at age four and 10 months as childcare? Absolutely, because that's what it is. It also is not required for kids to go to any form of school before

I mean, actually in South Carolina where I am, they're not even required to go to kindergarten. So it's first grade here. I don't know what it is in other States. So I can see people leaning more towards like absolutely yes, if it's before the age that children are required to get some type of education. ⁓ But beyond that, I agree with all the thoughts that have been shared so far. It's a much more nuanced discussion in my mind than just yes or no.

And like Lindsay brought up, like looking at it from the side of the educator, looking at it from the side of the parent, looking at it from a place of privilege or those that are not as privileged. There's so many different factors that I think would go into anyone's answer and based on their life experience and where they are in life at that specific time when asked this question, it's going to be different.

Chelsea Myers (1:16:53)
⁓ I'm not gonna give my hot take because I'm just kidding. I will say, I'm just gonna say, I'm also in It Depends and it's for all of the same reasons. ⁓ And especially, I don't see teachers as babysitters, but that doesn't mean that school isn't a safe and enriching place for kids to go, but it's also part of a system, a corporate America so that people can work. ⁓

And that's a whole other topic. And this is what I'm going to do. We're at the point where we have to go back to real life and we can't be odd moms anymore for a little while. And that makes me really sad. ⁓ But this is gonna, we're going to talk about this again, just like a lot of the other things we've talked about. We're going to talk about this again because, and now try your best. Don't say anything, no comments. We'll talk about it next time. But we didn't get to talk about.

Students being deported, students being taken out of school, college students losing their visas. We didn't talk about school free and reduced school lunches. didn't talk. So there are a lot of things that we didn't talk about. So we see you, we see you listeners, we hear you listeners, please give us your hot takes or you're not hot takes, you're just your takes so we can talk about this again. ⁓ But our kids are waking up and we have to go back to real life now.