Momocracy: Parenting In Political Chaos

In our first episode ofOdd Moms On Call, we kick things off by introducing ourselves and diving into why it’s so important to have open, judgment-free conversations about parenting—especially in today’s political climate. We share our different perspectives on how current events shape family life, with a focus on immigrant families and the ups and downs of managing mental health while raising kids. We also get into the role of education, how marginalized communities are treated, and why raising empathetic kids matters now more than ever.

Takeaways

• Creating safe spaces for difficult conversations is essential.
• Diverse perspectives enrich discussions about parenting.
• The political climate significantly impacts families and children.
• Immigrant families face unique challenges in today's society.
• Mental health is a crucial aspect of parenting.
• Education plays a vital role in shaping societal values.
• Dehumanization affects marginalized groups and must be addressed.
• Raising empathetic children is a priority for parents.
• Community support is vital for families facing challenges.
• Activism is necessary to combat systemic oppression.

Sound Bites

"We can disagree and still coexist."

"We are labeling these people as bad."

"It's going to take us moms saying no."

Got a hot take you want to share?

Send us a message, or email us at Oddmomsoncall@gmail.com. We might just talk about it on the show!

Be sure to follow us on Instagram, Threads, Youtube, and BlueSky!

Transcript

Chelsea Myers (00:35)
Hey, everybody. It's Odd Moms.

Britt (00:39)
Hey!

Courtney Ginder (00:40)
Hey!

Chelsea Myers (00:42)
This is episode one, this is really exciting. I'm really, really excited to connect with you guys. I think we should probably introduce ourselves so that people know who we are. Yeah, yeah. I can go, I'm Chelsea. I'm Chelsea, I am a non-binary stay-at-home mom.

Courtney Ginder (00:51)
I mean, maybe.

Britt (00:54)
Give us a little context.

Courtney Ginder (00:56)
Hahaha

Chelsea Myers (01:08)
disabled, chronically ill, all the fun things. I also host Quiet Connection podcast and I am so excited to chat with these odd moms and to be a part of this group.

Britt (01:23)
I'm Britt. I'm also a non-binary mom. I have four kiddos and I live here in the United States. I host the Odd Mom Pod and currently work as an international board certified lactation consultant and as a registered nurse.

Courtney Ginder (01:41)
Hey, I'm Courtney. I am a social media creator, content creator. I am a mom to two young kiddos. I am at Beyond PPD on Instagram. I focus on perinatal mental health as I am a postpartum depression survivor and became a parent during the COVID-19 pandemic.

Midori (02:02)
And I am Midori I have three little girls work in corporate America and I also have a business with my husband. It's called simply Midori and we have a podcast of a simply Midori podcast. And I also do a YAP cast where I just like YAP around. So I'm excited to continue this YAP conversation with odd moms as we, you know, have the difficult conversations. We really focus on relationship and stuff like that.

Chelsea Myers (02:20)
You

Midori (02:30)
So I think creating safe spaces, I really believe in creating safe spaces to have difficult conversations is so amazing for not only us, but for our kids and the generations to come, which is how we can sometimes disagree and still coexist in a very, very friendly way. We don't always have to agree on every single thing to be friends and support one another in their different ways of life.

Chelsea Myers (02:57)
Yeah, I think what I'm most excited about with Odd Moms is that no two episodes are going to be the same. Just because you're hearing from us today doesn't mean we will all be here in episode two or like we've got a whole group of us and we're on call. So if we want to record, we record and if we don't, we don't. So strap in because we're odd and we're moms.

Courtney Ginder (03:04)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Britt (03:26)
I think it's the best of both worlds though. I think I'm really excited, I think mostly to get different perspective from different people who are being impacted by different things that are currently happening. We're all US based, correct? Okay. Who are outside?

Courtney Ginder (03:33)
Thank you.

Chelsea Myers (03:40)
Yes, but we do have moms that are going to be on the

Courtney Ginder (03:40)
Yes.

Chelsea Myers (03:43)
show who are outside of the US. Yeah.

Britt (03:47)
Yeah, well, and

I love that because, you know, especially in today's political climate, which is kind of our topic of today is, you know, it is impacting different people's lives in different capacities. And right now it seems like the open conversation of of experiences of human experiences.

is being so shut down by our media and being bought out and being very censored and hindered. And so so excited to have a space where we can kind of talk about that, give different perspectives and understand how different things that are happening in our world may impact lives individually.

Chelsea Myers (04:32)
Yeah. I mean, let's get into it. that's the other cool thing about this group, especially as like we're all over the country. So yeah, we're all in the U S but we're all in very different states. And so our experience of what's happening in the U S right now is probably pretty different. Like, I mean, I mean, we were just saying before we started recording, so I'm in Vermont, we are a very liberal state.

Courtney Ginder (04:55)
Mm-hmm.

Chelsea Myers (05:02)
we have not seen a huge impact directly in terms of the current administration and unelected officials making policies. we were seeing it a teeny tiny bit. had like a blip for a day where like, nonprofits weren't able to access their funding and like, or their, their

finances or whatever, and then it was back up. But other than that, like, ICE is in our state right now, but it's pretty minimal. We did have the head of ICE here because we just had a Border Patrol officer killed at the Canadian border, which was not related to anything having to do with our current administration, or at least that's what we're being told.

Midori (05:50)
which was.

Chelsea Myers (05:58)
But other than that, everyone's preparing, but we're not really seeing a lot of the stuff right now. I'm curious what it's like for you guys.

Courtney Ginder (06:09)
I'm in Indiana, so I am in a red state. Our new governor is a Trump acolyte, basically. The first things he did was when he came into office, we signed executive orders, know, removing DEI from our government, from our state government. I'm a parent of a child who's hard of hearing. My son has unilateral hearing loss in his left ear, so we get a lot of services, like through First Steps.

Midori (06:15)
is.

Thank you.

Yes.

Sorry.

you

Courtney Ginder (06:36)
that sort of thing and there's just been a bill introduced in the Senate, our state Senate, that wants to dismantle the Center for Deaf and Hard of Hearing Education. So not only am I having to call my, you know, my congresspeople, I now need to call my state legislators and be like, hey, don't take those services away from kids with disabilities who need them. Like, are you kidding me?

Britt (06:57)
I'm in Oklahoma. So we're seeing a lot of implications here and as an out trans individual, you know, there's a lot of safety concerns, concerns around, are they gonna literally take my kids away? Like, you know, things like that. But we're also seeing it big time in our school systems here with our state superintendent here, Ryan Walters is

Chelsea Myers (07:12)
Yeah.

Midori (07:22)
Thank you.

Britt (07:25)
I'm sure you've seen him on national news because he's such a gem of a human being sarcasm implied. But we're seeing a lot of changes in our school systems, dismantling of our programs that help disabled children in our schools. I have multiple of my kids are neuro spicy. I'm of the neuro spicy variety as well. so, you know, impacts as far as safety and

Midori (07:26)
What do you mean, you're not doing anything?

Chelsea Myers (07:31)
my god.

Midori (07:38)
Thank

So, thank

Britt (07:53)
know, IEPs and things like that that are so important, but then also, you know, with the redefinition of gender and things like that, how that is, especially in a red state, is going to be so outwardly impacted. It's honestly really scary.

Chelsea Myers (08:12)
Yeah.

Courtney Ginder (08:12)
I feel

that as a fellow Red Stater.

Britt (08:15)
Mm-hmm.

Midori (08:16)
What's Neuro- What's Neuro Spicy? I'm so sorry. I was like, should I Google- I was like, should I Google this? Like, no, should I just-

Chelsea Myers (08:19)
That's a great question!

Britt (08:19)
I have audio I have have AUDHD so I have a touch of the autism and the ADHD

No, it's a term that us neurodivergent folks use this to say that we're just a little spicy. We're just a little different. We add a little kick.

Chelsea Myers (08:35)
We're a little spicy. Add a little spice. Yeah.

Midori (08:38)
I love it. And then I was like, is this like a natural reference? was like,

Courtney Ginder (08:39)
I'm

Midori (08:43)
what is it? Sorry, it's a touch of what?

Britt (08:46)
I have, yeah, so I have autism and ADHD. it's, I'm very neuro-spicy. So a lot of, all of my children have a little spice in them too.

Chelsea Myers (08:46)
It's neurodiversity.

Midori (08:49)
Got it.

Narrow safety.

I love it. Okay,

Courtney Ginder (08:57)
Yes.

Chelsea Myers (08:58)
Same with

Midori (08:58)
great.

Chelsea Myers (08:58)
this, same with this family. Same with it.

Midori (09:00)
I feel like

everyone diagnosed or undiagnosed probably falls under NeuroSpicy to some degree.

Chelsea Myers (09:06)
We all have a little bit of spice What are you seeing Midori? Are you noticing anything since the-

Midori (09:09)
Yeah.

Yeah, so we're

in Illinois. so we're right outside of Chicago. So I lived in the city for like 15 years. And we live right outside of the city now, like 30 minutes. And I go into the city for work. So I don't guess. Like, it's really heartbreaking. You walk around the affluent areas of the city. it's like gut-wrenching.

Like if you remove the politics and policy from it, just like I'm a humanities standpoint, it's heartbreaking. You like look around and you see us, right? Like you see moms of young children. This is the deportation, all that started in Chicago, but you look around and you just see moms kids. Like they're not like, and it's like all mom and children and they don't speak English. They're obviously in a different country and

Chelsea Myers (09:59)
Yeah.

Midori (10:08)
You're just like, pure humanity, this is not okay. Like what, and like, it's like too big of a problem for like me, like my one person to like do anything about. it's like, you need, you know, policy and people in place to like help to some degree, just from a pure humanity standpoint. Like I'm like, I remember walking past this and I walk with my children. Obviously we were in the city. It was my husband, me and my two older ones.

I think I didn't have the baby yet. So it was probably, I'm rambling, but it was before I had the baby. But I remember this mom, she must've been in her mid-20s, was sitting there under a blanket and there was movement under the blanket. And I was like, I'm just gonna keep walking because I don't know what's going on underneath the blanket. It was midday and out pops this little boy. And he's probably around the same age as my three-year-old. He was probably, I was like,

I can't just like walk past this and like not acknowledge like the human, like this is crazy. And like, what am I going to do? Like, I can't bring you guys home. can't, you know, like I can give you money and we gave them money and we like got them food, but it's like, this is so, this is such a, I feel so, I'm like, is such a temporary And I'm like, is this selfish? It's only making me feel better for the moment. Like how is, what's the big picture? And it's like, I have yet to see a

Chelsea Myers (11:14)
Yeah.

Midori (11:31)
any political side, Republican or Democrat, create a great solution from a humanity standpoint. Like, how are we making their lives better? You know, one of my coworkers who's become one of my really good friends, does one of the friends run the food pantries in the city? And she's like, the influx of people that need things is insane. I'm like, well, your little food pantry isn't going to solve the problems. Like, what are we going to do? And like, how do we actually

Chelsea Myers (11:38)
yeah.

Midori (11:59)
find a solution that like unifies like I get there's going to be disagreement. I get it. Not everyone's going to agree. But like these are also humans that

they're displaced regardless of like your stance on, you know, like you want Trump or you don't want Trump or you love Trump, whatever your stance is, like these, these are still displaced humans. So can we remove the politics for a moment and just figure out like an actual solution? Cause shipping them from one country to another country, from one state to another state isn't actually solving the problem. We're just, and as a mom, I'm like, what the heck? would like, these are kids guys. Like,

These are children. They didn't ask us. They don't even speak the language. They just literally want food and to go play at a park. And they know no difference. So it's overwhelming. So in Chicago, you see it firsthand. You see it. And it's wild.

Chelsea Myers (12:31)
Yeah.

Courtney Ginder (12:40)
Mm-hmm.

Chelsea Myers (12:50)
so many different things that you said. Like, brain went ping, ping, ping, ping, ping. I don't know if yours did that. like, well, like so many different aspects of it. Like, yeah, so we don't, again, in Vermont, we don't have a lot of, we don't have a large immigrant population in terms of like from the way that the media is spinning it. Like we don't have Hispanic and Latin American, like all that. We have,

Midori (12:57)
I'm

Chelsea Myers (13:20)
We have immigrants, most of them are from other countries that the government is not focusing on right now. But the way that families in my state are being impacted, and my family specifically, it's very expensive to live here. And so regardless of who you are, it's even harder obviously if you are here as an immigrant.

it felt like the cost of everything overnight went way up because we're obviously having tariffs and prices and wars with the North and the South right now, Mexico and Canada. And I'm on disability. Like I can't work. My kids are on Medicaid. it's like, so we can't afford basic things right now.

Courtney Ginder (13:52)
Mm-hmm.

Chelsea Myers (14:16)
I can't imagine what the families who are here who are displaced are going through and the fear that they're going through. me, someone who is, I mean, I'm female presenting, I'm white, I'm in what appears to be a hetero relationship, but my kids are on Medicaid, I'm on disability, I don't know if I'm going to get my disability check this month. I don't know if my kid's Medicaid is going to be taken away.

Courtney Ginder (14:41)
Mm-hmm.

Chelsea Myers (14:46)
I just ordered groceries and what should have cost, what would have cost like $150 probably a month ago cost $280. So I'm thinking about, yeah, you think about those people that you're seeing in the street right now and you're thinking about how can I help them and what can I do? And that's so much bigger too than like, I can give them some food or I can give them some money. It's like.

Who the fuck do I call? Like, what calls do I make? What protests do I go to and still stay safe and still keep my kids safe? I feel like that was a ramble. But yeah.

Courtney Ginder (15:20)
Mm-hmm.

Britt (15:22)
No, but I think it's accurate.

Courtney Ginder (15:24)
Yeah.

Britt (15:25)
I mean, I think so I work in the emergency department here in a very low income area of town in Oklahoma City. And we haven't had ICE raids yet. are some of our schools have just started seeing some ICE show up. But like, what's wild is even living in a red state and the corporations that are running these like our our hospital has given us zero communication.

Midori (15:30)
Mm-mm.

Britt (15:50)
on how to handle an ICE raid or what our rights are as healthcare providers. And we're seeing this insane influx. Like we already see a very, very large homeless population in the emergency department I work in of all ages for various things. And these people already come in so sick, so starving. We have people that have frostbite from being out in the ice. We have people who are dying of heat stroke from being out in the heat, you know? And then you have

these families that literally homeless families that will come in that cannot find an open space in one of the two shelters in our state or in our city. And Oklahoma's passing a bill currently that is reducing, they are not allowing homeless shelters or programs that serve homeless people in any counties unless the county has, I think, over 300,000 people.

Midori (16:30)
Thanks.

Britt (16:49)
which means our entire very rural state will now have two cities, Oklahoma City and Tulsa, that will be now carrying the entire brunt of caring for our homeless population. And with the prices of all of these things going up, people losing disability, people losing their children's Medicaid, the amount of people who are now going to be homeless or unable to provide, we're now losing

Midori (16:53)
Thank you.

Britt (17:19)
the programs and spaces that are safe spaces for them. And as medical providers, we're panicking because we already have these homeless people come in and they are riddled with pneumonia and so incredibly sick and they end up in the ICU for weeks. And we know that they're not gonna be any type of payment to the hospital for those. But yet we're not also solving.

Midori (17:38)
Thank

Britt (17:44)
any of the problem of ensuring that we're providing people with safe, clean living spaces that prevent them from getting this sick. And so it's just, it's so frustrating, like you guys said, to kind of see and be in the periphery of it, but also feeling like there is, there's only so much that we can do as individuals and the systems that have been set up in place to protect and support these types of.

Midori (17:49)
Thank you.

Thanks

Courtney Ginder (18:05)
Mm-hmm.

Britt (18:13)
things so that individuals didn't have to worry about doing this is now going to fall back on us and our communities. And it's really hard to figure out, like, how do I help and where do I step up and in what way? Because it just kind of feels futile at this point.

Courtney Ginder (18:28)
Right.

And Midori you mentioned too, talking about the humanity of it all. Like it feels like so much of that humanity has been stripped away. It's just like, you know, homeless people are just, they've been turned into this massive blob of people or like immigrants. They're all this kind of people and all that individual humanity has been taken away to turn into kind of like an us versus them thing. And that's absolutely horrifying. That's how these kind of programs get passed is

You know, they don't see them as people anymore.

Britt (19:04)
Yeah, I think that, sorry.

Chelsea Myers (19:04)
I mean, let's be real, they're... it's okay,

Midori (19:05)
it.

Chelsea Myers (19:07)
I was gonna say, let's be real. They're already putting these people in camps. They're putting these people in camps or they're dropping them in countries that they don't... They never came from in the first place. It's happening right now.

Britt (19:12)
Mm-hmm.

Courtney Ginder (19:12)
Yes, in Guantanamo Bay, yes.

Yeah. Yeah, like what

was it El Salvador offered to take people even if they're not from El Salvador?

Chelsea Myers (19:24)
Yeah!

And it's not a concept. It's happening right now.

Britt (19:27)
wild.

Courtney Ginder (19:32)
Yeah.

Britt (19:33)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Midori (19:34)
Yeah,

just like perpetuates a cycle so there's like never a solution it's like what are we like what and then it's like I don't yeah, it's just like such a crazy It is a crazy thing to like live through like did you ever think this is the conversation? we'd be having like I know it's like so naive. It's like what this is like the Millennium happen guys. I thought we were like

Courtney Ginder (19:46)
Mm-hmm.

No

Chelsea Myers (19:49)
I

I mean.

Midori (19:57)
And it's like, feel like we like just retracted back in time. And then, you know, you get the presidential election and our options are like Joe Biden and Trump. And it's like, do we not have anyone? We have no one better that can run for president right now. Like these are two options.

Chelsea Myers (20:09)
I

I think we had a better candidate. That's my personal opinion. really, I know that we, I know, I will say with my full chest that Kamala had been elected, we would not have Elon Musk running our country right now. Yes.

Britt (20:15)
I agree.

Courtney Ginder (20:16)
Yes.

Correct. Correct.

Midori (20:28)
Well,

Britt (20:29)
is accurate.

Midori (20:31)
And at the same time,

though, I feel fully capable, though, right? I don't think she should have been an option. I'm like...

Britt (20:34)
my gosh, I think so.

Courtney Ginder (20:35)
Yes.

Chelsea Myers (20:38)
right?

I that's what it is. So this is great. This is awesome. This is our first point of like, yeah, how do you really feel about it? I think yes. I think yeah.

Britt (20:47)
I think that

when you look at like the the rap sheet of things that she accomplished in in her various career from law school and education and the policies that she implemented to help reduce homelessness and arrests for drug attempts or drug charges uh-huh yeah and and releasing people from jail systems that were in

Midori (20:53)
Hmm.

Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (21:08)
like misdemeanors, like, yeah.

Britt (21:15)
jail for drug offenses. I'm very pro on the fact that I do not think drugs in any capacity should be a criminal offense. You doing drugs does not impact anybody else's life, honestly. I think there's way too many people locked up in our criminal systems, especially those of minority ethnicities that are

put into prisons for incredibly large amount of times for incredibly minuscule, especially drug charges. And the impact of that generationally on families is massive, especially in our younger communities and our BIPOC communities where they are now losing the generational stability that white people have had and we're continuing to dismantle

their ability to create generational wealth or generational stability that helps lift people out of poverty situations because of the insane amount of people we're putting in jail, which is crazy because now we're only doing that even more so and doing it for even more things like immigration. Like that's wild that that is now becoming a criminal situation. And then with the switch of the legalized on the fifth, the federal death penalty again.

Chelsea Myers (22:27)
Yeah.

Midori (22:34)
Yes.

Chelsea Myers (22:38)
Yeah.

Courtney Ginder (22:39)
and

Britt (22:39)
and

listed on there as one of the reasons of being allowed to be killed was being an immigrant in the United States that did a minor crime. Yes, that was listed.

Chelsea Myers (22:48)
I didn't know that. I didn't know that.

Midori (22:51)
I think that

Courtney Ginder (22:52)
and

see them.

Midori (22:52)
one probably passed though. I think it was presented, but I don't think it actually passed. I mean, it's insane that like that. Yeah, it's insane.

Britt (22:55)
I don't know if it passed or not, but I do know that it was, that's even coming up, yeah. And so

Chelsea Myers (23:01)
Yeah.

Courtney Ginder (23:01)
Mm-hmm.

Britt (23:03)
I think it's just continually, I think the dehumanization is one thing where I think those in power and those who are completely shut off emotionally have been primed by our society to dehumanize their own experience, so much so that they now cannot humanize the experience of another human being. They physically are unable to.

Chelsea Myers (23:23)
Yeah.

Britt (23:25)
And so when we're seeing these incredibly high incarceration rates and things like that, and you look at Kamala Harris's plan for things that she was trying to do to make things more affordable for families, like down payment assistance on homes, that helps people get livable situations and helps families build generational wealth and pull systems and families out of poverty.

that there would have been no way we would have ended up in this capacity if Kamala would have been elected. And I think that a lot of the, may have not been capable is very rooted in sexist or even sometimes racist views of like, well, this rap sheet of this human who has all this education, all of this.

work in legislation. She was the most effective vice president who was the voting person that broke the most tied electoral votes out of any president in the United States history. And you can see everything that she voted for and what way she did. just don't, I personally don't see the, was she capable.

of leading our country more so than a white man with no education and no humanization and no in touch with security of understanding what it looks like to build security or foundational wealth for your family because it was handed to you. I just don't see how anyways, when you're comparing the two candidates that you can say that there was any way that she was less qualified than Donald Trump.

Midori (25:01)
I don't think that necessarily saying that she's less qualified or he's more qualified or vice versa. I just can't believe that as an American, like we're a massively powerful country. I don't understand how these are our two options. Like there's so many like people, just like, whatever, regardless of like, there's just, I feel like there's, I feel like politics has become such like a scary thing for people that we don't have like the best people representing our country.

Chelsea Myers (25:12)
Yeah.

Courtney Ginder (25:13)
Okay.

Chelsea Myers (25:26)
Well, it's all, that's all part of the game. It's designed that way. Yeah. Yeah.

Midori (25:29)
Yeah, that's what I mean. like, it's like just

Britt (25:30)
point.

Midori (25:32)
it's it's a it's a big scheme, right? Like they're actually the any president that's in is not fully running the country. They're backed by all these crazy amounts of money from who God knows where the money's coming from.

Courtney Ginder (25:40)
mmhmm

Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (25:43)
Well,

and Trump, even if you voted for Trump, he's not running our country right now. Elon Musk, Elon Musk is running our country right now. Yeah, I wanna steer us a teeny tiny bit, but just the tiniest bit. Some of you guys have really young kids and some of our kids are a little bit older. Are your kids asking any questions? Because mine are.

Courtney Ginder (25:48)
No, absolutely not.

Midori (25:48)
Yeah.

Yeah, it's like whoever can put the bill.

Courtney Ginder (25:55)
Yes.

Britt (26:12)
Mine are big time. We're talking about it a lot. My oldest is in fifth grade and being in a primarily red state, we've had a lot of conversations about voting and people and things like that from the very beginning of this presidential election. I'm very, very immersed in policies and that's something that's very important to my heart. I'm in grad school for a social justice program currently. And so even, you know, at this point,

even my education as being at risk, being at OU and being in a human relations and inclusive leadership program, like we potentially may be defunded as a program for my grad school program because of the rules. But in my daughter's school, they're seeing a lot of it as an older kid and she's asking a lot of questions. I'm openly trans with my kids. They know that I prefer they them pronouns and they have seen.

Chelsea Myers (26:52)
Yeah.

Britt (27:08)
media from all sides as I watch different things or whatnot and I try to have those conversations. But it's definitely been something that's been coming up in our home. And it's hard because you're having these conversations with a kid who has such a limited view of the world. But you also you want to protect that innocence, but also you want to ensure that your kids are educated and not being indoctrinated by other people in the school system when they go to school.

And so it's such a weird balance of trying to navigate what conversations do I have and what conversations do I not have and how to broach those to where she keeps the humanization of all sides still at the forefront of her brain.

Courtney Ginder (27:51)
Yes.

Chelsea Myers (27:52)
And I would imagine for like, like Courtney and Midori, your kids are younger. So, I mean, I would assume they're not asking as much, but like they've got to notice the stress. They've got to notice the stress around them.

Courtney Ginder (27:56)
Mm-hmm.

Mm hmm.

They're not I have a I have a four year old, almost five year old and an 18 month old. So obviously the 18 month old doesn't I mean, he's just doing his toddler thing. He doesn't he doesn't if it's not an animal or a car, he doesn't really care. But my with my both both of my kids, we have tried to stress, you know, the big picture of things like, you know, all families are valid. All people are valid. You know, you treat people with kindness and empathy.

Midori (28:12)
opportunity.

Courtney Ginder (28:32)
and trying to lay that groundwork so that hopefully they don't fall into this trap of dehumanization and see, you know, not believing that all people are valid and all people's stories and all people's existences are valid.

Britt (28:46)
Yeah, we do a lot of book reading and trying to make sure our books are full of different life experiences and people of different gender identities and people of different family. I like to make sure we have books full of different family dynamics and things like that because I think that is one of the one things that we can do in all of this. what I keep reminding myself in all of this is

Chelsea Myers (28:46)
Yeah.

Courtney Ginder (28:49)
Mm-hmm.

Yes.

Thank you.

Yes.

Mm-hmm.

Britt (29:15)
is making sure that we're maximizing our circle of influence and ensuring that we're creating that space of safety and conversation and vulnerability in those spaces. I think for us, like books have been, children's books and picture books have been such a phenomenal way for us to kind of not default on conversations, but it helps to answer their questions without me falling into the trap of wanting to give them too much information.

Courtney Ginder (29:20)
Mm-hmm.

Britt (29:45)
and helps me kind of keep it relevant to their age, but also presents things in a way that's really age appropriate for them. But I think it's hard with these little kids because, like you said, one, they're just living their own lives. And it's like, how do we not burden our little ones with all of this so that they can continue to have the childhood that they deserve to have so that they can be grounded and attached and will serve human beings so that when they grow up in this world,

Chelsea Myers (29:46)
Mm.

Courtney Ginder (29:53)
Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Britt (30:14)
that they can go out and be successful adults, but also how do we ensure that our children are having their questions answered and ensuring that we are passing on the humanness and that empathy and compassion that has been so squashed in the outside society.

Midori (30:26)
in

Courtney Ginder (30:33)
Yes.

Yeah, we do the same thing. I mean, my husband and I have talked many times, we're a white family in the suburbs. Like, I mean, we're, it is very, it's been very important to us ever since our daughter was born back in 2020, that we have diverse books and they have diverse toys. And they have books and toys that people that don't look like them. Because I mean, there's living where we live, a lot of people look like them. And it's

Midori (30:36)
Jesus.

is

Chelsea Myers (30:57)
Mm-hmm.

Courtney Ginder (30:58)
It was important to me from the start that they have those diverse experiences and diverse books and diverse toys.

Midori (31:03)
Yeah, it's all like a very interesting dynamic for me first of all, my almost 6 year old is like, she actually does ask a lot of questions, but I think it's because what she's exposed to, right? Like she was born in 2019. our plan, so I guess I should give you context. I'm half Japanese, half Mexican, and my husband's half black, half Lebanese. And in my house, we have four generations living in my house.

So we have my kids, right? And then my grandparents live with us. So it's my kids, my husband and I, my mom and her sister and my grandparents, we all have under one roof. So just, feel like, but we live in the suburbs of Chicago. So the majority of our neighbors are white, which is like, know, I just, but I feel home is a very diverse age and race home. And the funny thing is, I mean, it's not funny.

Courtney Ginder (31:43)
Mm-hmm.

Midori (31:56)
My aunt and I see just completely opposite on political conversations, which I think is like the beautiful thing of what my kids get to be exposed to, right? Like they get to be exposed to like real time conversations of like disagreement conversations and real time love. Like as passionate as she is about what she believes in, I'm just as passionate about what I believe in.

But what's really been cool for them to be, and we let our kids be a part of the conversation. My three year old and my baby, they, it's just different. But my six year old is very engaged. She actually did like homeschool our kids too. So like the whole board of education dismantling thing is like a crazy, it's just like such an extreme thing. It's like, it's not necessary to be like that extreme, but I do think adjustments could be made to the board of education to better everybody that's involved.

But anyway, it just is, I think it just goes back to humanity. It's like, we want to teach our kids, like, you can disagree with somebody and still love somebody and still be friends with them and still be families with them. Doesn't mean you have to like not engage or, because I'm like, that's the, that I feel is like the actual issue is like so much division is coming in to whatever the situation is. And it's like, no, we can all.

completely have different viewpoints and still honor and respect the humanity of the other person.

Chelsea Myers (33:21)
I think I'm going to speak for myself here, but I think where that gets a little muddy, because I think that's the goal. I think that would be wonderful and a beautiful way to live. But I think where it gets a little muddy is when you are in those minority groups or you are in those groups that our current administration is demonizing.

Midori (33:23)
Yeah.

Courtney Ginder (33:50)
Mm-hmm.

Chelsea Myers (33:51)
and you have the administration actively stripping away your rights. And, when you, so like, have family members who are very, very, it's like, let's, okay, let's take like Trump off. Like we, it doesn't even have to be about Trump. Like they're very pro like deport the immigrants. They're very much like takeaway. like,

all of these things that are actually impacting them and they don't realize that if they're gone, they're going to be impacted. So they're very much conservative and whatever. And they can, yeah, we can disagree on a lot of things, but when you're backing policies that are actively taking away my safety and taking away the safety of my kids and taking away my rights and the rights of my kids, like I will never forget.

Courtney Ginder (34:35)
Mm-hmm.

in here.

Chelsea Myers (34:46)
and I may get flack for this. have got flack for this. I posted about it and then I took it down because I wasn't brave enough. But my nine year old came to me the, the day after the election and we talked to her and we told her who was elected and she said, mommy, are, are we even

allowed to go out anymore? Like, does daddy have to do everything now? Because my family knows that my kids know that I'm non-binary. My nine-year-old advocates for me. My nine-year-old will correct my mother-in-law. Like, no, it's not she, it's they. And she literally asked me, are we not allowed to go out anymore? Does daddy have to do everything now? And I was like, no. Like, obviously, obviously, I broke the... I'm like, no, no, no.

Courtney Ginder (35:30)
Mm-hmm.

Chelsea Myers (35:43)
And I'm like, and you don't have to worry about that. We're going to keep you safe no matter what. And I stand by that. like, yes, I would love to live in a world where we could disagree and show love for one another, but it's really, really hard for me. I think I worded it in a social media post, like the energy that I was giving to you before is now going to be directed at these people that are being

affected. Not that I'm going to actively like shit all over you. I'm not going to fight with you. I'm not going to do those things. I'm not going to go egg your house. But my energy is now going to go towards supporting those of us who are losing our rights and our safety. And I can't believe my nine year old, like my nine year old. And she was, she's like, do we have to take our pride flag down?

Midori (36:16)
you.

Courtney Ginder (36:29)
and

Britt (36:30)
Yeah.

Courtney Ginder (36:33)
Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (36:39)
I texted Britt, I texted Britt and I was like, I'm taking down my pronouns, I'm taking them off of my email, like Meta owns everything and I'm really scared that they're gonna make a database and like I'm afraid that they're gonna take my kids away and Britt talked me off the ledge. But like, but for her, she's nine years old and she knows we don't get super political but we do a lot, we talk a lot about compassion and empathy.

Britt (36:41)
Mm-hmm.

Courtney Ginder (36:52)
Mm-hmm.

Britt (36:58)
Yeah.

Courtney Ginder (37:09)
Mm-hmm.

Chelsea Myers (37:09)
And she's

also neurodiverse. That's a whole other thing. But for her to realize this is in her brain, I am a girl, mommy is non-binary, I know that this person that is now in power doesn't like us. What does that mean for me now? That broke my And I had people saying like,

Midori (37:28)
What is?

It's got wrenching.

Britt (37:34)
Yeah.

Courtney Ginder (37:35)
It's heartbreaking.

Chelsea Myers (37:37)
I had people saying like, what a terrible mother you are. Like, why would you scare your child like that? And I was like, whoa. I was like, I never once told my child like, if Trump gets elected, we're never going to be able to leave the house again. Like this is from her observations. Like we live in a very, very rural area in Vermont and she'll go to school and she'll hear the kids like this. said the boys at school were like,

Britt (37:40)
Mm-hmm.

Courtney Ginder (37:51)
Right.

Chelsea Myers (38:03)
going Trump, Trump, Trump on the bus and like so she and the whole movement that you saw like Your Body My Choice like hearing boys saying that in schools like she's hearing that she's hearing that so Yeah, it's like no. I'm not a shit mom like this is real. It's real

Courtney Ginder (38:13)
Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Britt (38:17)
Yeah.

Courtney Ginder (38:23)
No!

Midori (38:23)
Yeah.

Britt (38:24)
Yeah. Well,

and I think in all of this too, like I'm also very much in the camp where like I'm currently, I literally just sent a text to somebody a few minutes ago and was like, you're sharing the most absolutely inaccurate maga propaganda. And I am not interested in being affiliated with that. because for me at this point, it is an issue of morality. It's not, it's not an opinion.

Courtney Ginder (38:41)
Mm-hmm.

Britt (38:49)
You don't get to have an opinion on whether I as a non-binary individual should love somebody or express my gender in a certain way. You don't get a, that's not an opinion, that is hate. That's an issue of morality. I think the dehumanization of people with disabilities, I have lupus myself, but I'm very fortunate to be at a place in my health journey where I can work. That was not always the case. For a very long time, I was not able to work and bed bound for many, many months.

Courtney Ginder (39:13)
Mm-hmm.

Britt (39:18)
and to take away things like the Department of Education and disband something like that is actually actively targeting children who need additional services in school and removing those services from the school programs. That is not an issue of opinion on where funds are going. That's an issue of morality where if you think that those

Midori (39:27)
and in.

Thank you.

Chelsea Myers (39:46)
that they're worthy of

it.

Britt (39:47)
that they shouldn't deserve that. We have the voucher system here in Oklahoma and it's absolutely disgusting to think that that's somehow providing school choice when myself as a single mother who's going through a divorce and all of that where even if I wanted to send, I literally looked into a private school for my daughter and a fine arts school for middle school because I'm so terrified of her being in middle school here.

Courtney Ginder (39:47)
Right.

We do too.

Britt (40:14)
because of our education system in Oklahoma and the fact that like the voucher system provides school choice yet now all we're doing is funding private schools that were already completely funded that didn't have to provide any sort of special education or therapy services to children that they are actively allowed to deny that and even then being like okay now we're taking all of the money from your that we would use to fund your public school and now we're giving you to it's like

$7,000 a year towards a private school. The private schools here are still $24,000 a year. $7,000 a year doesn't even make it affordable for my child to go to a public, a private school, even if I wanted to as somebody who is working two jobs to make ends meet right now. You know, it's a, I think it's for me at this point, when we talk about politics and being able to

Chelsea Myers (40:50)
Yeah.

Britt (41:14)
to share or be able to love people that express differently when it comes down to an issue of morality and dehumanization of as me as a trans human, I don't deserve the same rights as my kids with metabolic conditions and neurodivergency. They don't deserve the same conditions at school that if I were to struggle with my health.

Midori (41:19)
Thank you.

Britt (41:39)
and be unable to work again. Now I do not have the safety nets of Medicaid and disability to fall back on to support my family. And I don't have the privilege of having a spouse that has a job that can support me anymore. It's actively dehumanizing and actively completely immoral in my opinion of human beings with very real circumstances. And I think sometimes when we're not

Midori (41:46)
support.

And thank

See later.

I don't know if can me.

Britt (42:08)
individually being impacted by certain things, it's easy to be like, yeah, I would do it differently. And some things need to be done differently, but it still completely falls on the issue of morality and humanization for me. I can't just I told I literally told a friend today, I will not associate with you anymore. If you are posting pro-maga things in a red state, that becomes a literal safety issue for me and my family.

Midori (42:24)
Great.

Britt (42:37)
And if things were to go south, I know that that person is not a safe person for me and my family. And I will not subject myself to unsafety anymore.

Chelsea Myers (42:49)
Yeah.

Midori (42:50)
I agree. think that there's given all these like policies and things. I think there's people like you and these situations that genuinely need these government, like government things that provide safety, right? And then there's another group of people who abuse the system, There's definitely people who take these things for granted Like my mom is a nurse in the juvenile detention center. And so we were talking about

criminals like leaving all like leaving a lot of these criminals on the streets puts puts puts people in danger puts my kids in danger put people in danger so there's like a there's an extreme on both sides and I think

Britt (43:33)
But my thing is,

is what are these children as a juvenile detention center in prison for? What kinds of crime?

Midori (43:38)
Some of them are literally

in for prison for being murders at 12.

Britt (43:42)
I'm sure some of

Chelsea Myers (43:42)
Yeah.

Britt (43:43)
them

are, but other are for stealing things. Okay, why are we jailing people?

Midori (43:47)
No, I mean, I'm in Illinois. I'm

in like a very liberal state. And these are kids that are being put in prison from Cook County. So like these are these are not the majority of these kids are in prison for very, very heinous crimes. And they're they're repeat offenders, right? So so as a as a government, we're not.

Britt (44:00)
Right.

They're children and so that's what they

be, but they're children and they're also, but are we then we're de-stripping any of the programs that would support them to be able to rehabilitate.

Midori (44:16)
Right, which I think is wrong. It's like,

how do we actually help them to not be repeat offenders? Right? So like they leave and they come back and then what ends up happening is they leave at 12, come back at 14, leave at 16, come back at 18. Now they're in adult prisons. And now it's like their whole life is in jail. And it's like, but what are we doing as a public society? Or what are we doing as a government to use the funds that they're getting to actually get them out of this system and not put them back on the South and West sides, like out of sight, out of mind.

Chelsea Myers (44:18)
Right.

Midori (44:45)
You know what mean? It's like, I agree. Like if it's not affecting you, people just ignore it and turn a blind eye. Like, everything's gonna be great, right? It's not. Like it's not great right now. And if we just continue to turn a blind eye and not have the...

Britt (44:58)
But I mean, crime rates are down

over the last centuries. Yeah, they were until the reelection.

Chelsea Myers (45:01)
Well, they were. Yeah, they were.

Courtney Ginder (45:03)
me.

Chelsea Myers (45:05)
But OK, I'm I want to like. In Chicago, well.

Midori (45:05)
Crime rates are extremely up in Chicago. In Chicago,

they are very, very high.

Chelsea Myers (45:13)
I'm pausing and taking a moment to acknowledge because I feel us all getting heated. But this is what Odd Moms is about. We can feel differently and we all are going to have a seat at the table. So yeah, we feel really different right now. I feel all of us. I can see all of us, whether you're watching this or listening to this.

Midori (45:27)
No, no, I appreciate it. I appreciate the difficult conversations.

you

Courtney Ginder (45:42)
You

Chelsea Myers (45:42)
All

these four windows have different energy in them right now. But that's why we're here. That's why we're here because we're not going to be afraid to tell how we feel about it. And we're also not going to... Like Midori, can talk about your experience where you are right now. And Britt can absolutely be like, I don't agree with that at all.

Midori (46:11)
Yeah. I love it. think, yeah.

Chelsea Myers (46:11)
And that's so like, and we could talk about both. We can talk about

both. There's space for both. Yeah. I just, I don't know. I wanted to like pause it there because I felt like we needed a collective breath. And also acknowledge like for listeners, like anybody, anybody should be able to resonate with something that one of us is saying.

Courtney Ginder (46:28)
No.

Mm-hmm.

Chelsea Myers (46:41)
Like, obviously we're not representing every demographic here right now. It would be wonderful if we could. But yeah, like, I have very big feelings right now and I'm acknowledging that and I'm taking a breath. I'm not silencing myself, but I'm going to take a breath because think, yeah, you know what? I'm just...

I said I was gonna be me on this podcast. So I'm gonna be me on this podcast. So what I worry about and Midori, I'm not challenging your viewpoint at all, but what...

Midori (47:04)
Yeah, be brave, tell us. I love it.

No, you should. I mean, it's great. Like I want to mention on my viewpoints.

I think this is what happened is like we people come to the table at different viewpoints and then they get, you know, we have big feelings and they get angry and they walk away from the table. So I don't actually get to learn from an authentic different viewpoint because there's anger. Yeah. And vice versa. Like I also probably leave the table because it's like, so I'm, I appreciate it. I think it's wonderful.

Chelsea Myers (47:27)
Yeah.

Britt (47:32)
So yeah.

Chelsea Myers (47:39)
No, well, it's

so like I what what worries me and what worries me about like the perspective that you're giving is that we've learned that a lot of people have that perspective that a lot of people have the perspective that there are people abusing the system and that's why we have to take care of this and that's why we need a better prison system and this that and the other thing and the fact of well, okay.

Courtney Ginder (48:01)
Mm-hmm.

Chelsea Myers (48:05)
my research. No, don't want to say the f- okay, so in- be- yes.

Midori (48:08)
No, you can use it. You can use a factual paper. That's totally fine.

But I will, I have a question. In your language

though, you're using like a we and you, right? Like we feel, which is already, which I feel like is divisive because it's like, I'm not a part of the conversation. It's a meaning against you where it's like, how do we, and I feel I definitely do that too. So it's like, how do we eliminate that? Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (48:20)
Yeah, I know. Is divisive. Right.

Yeah, so let's say that viewpoint is

harmful, I believe, that is what the people who are in power right now, that is what they want you to think. So they are, and again, I'm using that us and they thing, but I'm not referring it towards you right now. I really am directing it at

Midori (48:55)
Yeah, that's right.

Chelsea Myers (48:58)
the 1 % and the people like the musks and the Bezos's and the all of these people who are now have their hands in everything. They want you to think those things so that they can keep perpetuating the, God, mom brain fizzled out so that they can keep perpetuating these systems to keep.

Britt (49:25)
of oppression.

Courtney Ginder (49:26)
Mm-hmm.

Chelsea Myers (49:27)
Yes,

of oppression. So they want you to think that immigrants are bad. They want you to think that drug users are bad. And I'm putting it in the most simple terms possible. even at this point, they want you to think trans people are bad. And in doing that, they're making it OK for us to like, get them out of our country.

Courtney Ginder (49:48)
Mm-hmm.

Chelsea Myers (49:55)
put them in jails, which jails are just modern day slavery. mean, and they're saying, well, we don't have to fund mental health programs. We don't have to fund rehabilitation programs. We don't have to put money there because these people are bad. So we're just going to put them away. And that is where I think it gets really muddy.

Britt (50:00)
Yup.

Thank

Chelsea Myers (50:23)
And maybe it's not muddy. Maybe it's crystal clear. Maybe it's just like, they are creating this us versus them thing. I mean, I'm, I'm non-binary. I'm not bad. I don't want to give your kid a sex change. I don't want to make your kid gay. I, I'm pansexual. I like, I don't, I'm not going to hit on you. I like, you know what I mean? Like I.

Courtney Ginder (50:29)
Mm-hmm.

Chelsea Myers (50:53)
I'm disabled, I'm not unworthy of support. And yeah, these are things that personally affect me. But I can also look at the person who immigrated here from Nigeria. Like we went to so many, we had this wonderful program at our college where we would have Nigerian immigrants come and I can look at that person, I can look at the place that they came from. And I can know I didn't live that, I didn't experience that.

But I can also look at them and be like, you deserve to be here. You deserve a roof over your head. Everyone deserves a roof over their head. So now I'm rambling. But like I do, I have big feelings because yeah, there is divisiveness, but they're the one, they're creating it. They want you to think that way. That sounds really conspiracy theorist-y, but I know.

Courtney Ginder (51:45)
Hahaha

Britt (51:46)
But it's not though. mean, so I was a foster mom.

So like from my own personal experience, like I believe that you cannot criticize the system unless you've actually attempted to try and make a difference. I just don't think you can. I don't feel like you have the availability to, yeah, the knowledge or the experience. So I was a foster mom for three years and took multiple kids who had crime history and things like that.

Courtney Ginder (51:55)
Mm-hmm.

Chelsea Myers (52:00)
Like the knowledge.

Britt (52:14)
It's wild that we're so quick to pin that these like teens are a problem when in reality it's the fact that they grew up watching their parents be arrested for drugs when they shouldn't have been, be brutalized by police when they shouldn't have been. Their parents were put in jail for stealing food or things that they needed to survive. We destructed and dismantled the systems that are now gonna help provide the ensure that these kids are getting healthcare.

Midori (52:32)
and we'll next time.

Britt (52:42)
We're turning children into criminals by destabilizing and perpetuating poverty circumstances for families of color and immigrants. That's what we're doing. So like, yeah, of course our system is going to continue to thrive on that. If you haven't read the book, a book called The Pedagogy of the Oppressed, I would 100 % recommend it. It's very fascinating.

Midori (52:59)
Thank

Cheers.

Britt (53:06)
talks all about the study of oppression and tactics used to continue systems of oppression and why people continue systems of oppression. It's very eye-opening. But as a foster mom who has literally parented some of these children that are labeled as problems and recommitting offenders, and one, it's because these kids, don't have any supportive systems or structures. They don't have mental health advocacy.

Midori (53:31)
Thank you.

Britt (53:36)
They don't have rehabilitation programs for these kids. They don't have enough safe spaces for teenagers to go to. They go to group homes. They go to, which are essentially the private or the the jail system, just in a home that's considered better. But in reality, we're continuing to...

Chelsea Myers (53:53)
Right.

Britt (54:01)
these systems of oppression and then are labeling literal children who don't even have brains, capacitated, formed enough to be making these decisions as criminals before they're even adults. Of course they're going to make bad decisions because of what they've been shown and what they had to do to survive without any sort of stability or structure. And then we're just continuing to populate our for-profit, for-profit prison system.

Chelsea Myers (54:27)
prisons.

Courtney Ginder (54:29)
mmhmm

Britt (54:31)
saying that all these people are bad and so criminals, but when you look at it, like statistically immigrants are less likely to commit crimes than US born citizens. Yeah, they don't want you to also the number one cause of teenage pregnancy in the United States is adult white men. Teenage pregnancy, number one cause adult white men. I, my, my son, I adopted my son from foster care because his

Chelsea Myers (54:38)
because they don't want to get deported.

Courtney Ginder (54:39)
Yes.

Midori (54:43)
So, yeah. Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (54:49)
Yes.

Courtney Ginder (54:49)
Mm-hmm.

Midori (54:51)
Okay.

Chelsea Myers (54:55)
yeah.

Britt (55:00)
biological father and their uncles were physically abusing all four children in the home. His oldest sister who is 16 now, is now, she completely does not trust her foster family. She's chosen to live on the streets and stuff because she has been told and shown her entire life that no adult is safe for her. And she is choosing that life because for her that feels safer and more consistent and less at a risk of abuse than being in the foster care system.

Chelsea Myers (55:31)
So let's acknowledge too that some of these kids, these kids who are quote unquote offending are coming from families that are abusive or have watched their parents murder someone or have...

Britt (55:31)
That is a problem.

Yeah, or they are

Courtney Ginder (55:46)
Mm-hmm.

Britt (55:47)
murdering their people who are abusing them. Like that's my other thing that you have these teenagers like that will like abuse an adult. It does.

Chelsea Myers (55:50)
Right, right, but what I mean is, right, it boils down to mental health. It

boils down to mental health

Midori (55:58)
at that. I

Courtney Ginder (55:59)
Yes.

Chelsea Myers (55:59)
and it boils down to we're doing nothing to address the issue. We are, the four people in this chat right now are, and we're talking to our kids in a way that ensures that they see people as humans and that they feel safe and that they, and hopefully remain that way.

Midori (55:59)
100 % at that. Yeah.

Courtney Ginder (56:13)
Mm-hmm.

Chelsea Myers (56:19)
But like, but yeah, so yes, there's this whole side of the criminal system where we are putting people in prisons for misdemeanors or for really, really petty crimes. so parents are being taken away, but then you also do have, you have experiences where kids are being abused. You have kids who are witnessing very violent crimes and that comes back to, okay, let's keep going back generation by generation by generation. Who stepped in and said enough. Okay, what do you need?

You need to do some intense one-on-one therapy. You need to do some rehabilitation. We need to detox you from whatever drug that you're on. We're doing nothing to help people. are labeling. Exactly. We're labeling these people, and most of the time it's minorities, as bad and putting them away. where I think that that comes back to, and I don't know how you talk about this,

Midori (57:00)
like the root issue.

Courtney Ginder (57:02)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Chelsea Myers (57:18)
with your kids, don't do something like my grandparents are like, that's ridiculous. We don't do like good or bad or like, what a good girl or like, that was bad. Don't do that. Like we don't overgeneralize. We talk about how like that, like that your decisions, every decision that you make has a consequence. And some consequences can be good consequences. And some consequences can be really, really harmful.

Britt (57:29)
Yeah,

Courtney Ginder (57:40)
Mm-hmm.

Chelsea Myers (57:47)
So like your decision to push your sister down because she knocked over whatever you were playing with, that had a pretty negative consequence because now she's screaming and you feel upset and everybody's upset. So we talk about how our actions impact other people rather than like, well, you're a bad kid, go to your room. You're a bad kid.

And I think that's the difference too between this could be its own episode in and of itself, but like, like the boomers and the millennials and how we are reparenting ourselves and how we are trying to raise kids differently. So, but it's going to be really, really hard to maintain that when they're watching everyone around us or not. I don't want to say everyone around us when they're watching the people.

Courtney Ginder (58:18)
Hahaha!

Midori (58:19)
Hahaha

Courtney Ginder (58:24)
Mm-hmm.

Britt (58:34)
Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (58:44)
I'm rambling again, but my nine-year-old, again, is talking about, she's like, well, how do these people, why do these people get to make the decisions? And it's like, well, it's like, because they have money. And she's like, but why does that matter? And I said, it shouldn't, but the people who have the money have the power. And she's like, well, then just take the power away. And I'm like, I can't take the

Courtney Ginder (59:03)
it does.

it be really cool.

Chelsea Myers (59:13)
Right? I, for some, she's like, well, why do they, why do they want more of it? And I'm like, it's just, it just seems to be the way of, like, I don't, I still don't say like, well, they're bad people. I'm like, the way that it seems to be working is that the more money you have, the more power you get, so you want more money so that you can have more power. And so it's going to be really, really hard to maintain that as a mom.

when they're seeing that the people who are making the decisions and the people who are having power and influence over our lives are creating this good versus bad.

Courtney Ginder (59:52)
Mm-hmm. I agree.

Britt (59:53)
Yeah. And

I think it boils back down to that dehumanization where when we're like, all of these people are breaking into homes and doing all that, there are all these crime and like, but I also think that we're not looking at the number one reason that people steal stuff is because they don't have what they need. Like people steal stuff. Yeah. People steal stuff to sell things, to feed their children.

Midori (59:56)
Thank you.

Chelsea Myers (1:00:14)
because they can't afford it.

Britt (1:00:20)
at end of the day, ethically, is that wrong? Yes, that they should have stolen from, they should not have stolen from somebody. But at the end of the day, we're still breaking it down to that we're continuing to build these systems of oppression where we're giving people the, this mentality or thought that people are not wanting to work when in reality, if we look at it, the jobs that they're able to get.

Chelsea Myers (1:00:20)
And I mean, it is right.

Britt (1:00:44)
can't pay enough for them to provide those things for themselves. So yes, it makes more logical sense for them to financially stay on the system because our minimum wage isn't high enough for people to be able to actually afford to work a job unless they have the ability to go to college or get some sort of advanced degree to where they can make enough money. It doesn't matter. No. And I mean, and that's where I'm at. Like I'm, as a mom, like I'm...

Courtney Ginder (1:00:46)
and

Chelsea Myers (1:01:02)
and that doesn't matter anymore. No, that doesn't matter anymore. No. Having a-

Courtney Ginder (1:01:04)
No. No.

Midori (1:01:07)
Thank

Britt (1:01:10)
I'm literally killing myself. I'm working almost 50 hours a week, working overnight shifts in the emergency department to be able to make ends meet and to be able to afford groceries where like I've looked, if I quit one of my jobs, I would qualify for Medicaid disability and all of this stuff because one of my jobs doesn't pay well enough for me to not have to live off those things. So it's.

Midori (1:01:16)
Thank

Britt (1:01:32)
A lot of times with this idea or this thought that people are being selfish and living off of the system, when a 2 % tax cut on billionaires for one year would eliminate homelessness, like the only people who are living in greed and selfishness at that point aren't the people who are unable to make enough money to make ends meet. It's the people who are hoarding so much money that they could end these problems and they choose not to. That's the problem.

Courtney Ginder (1:01:45)
Mm-hmm.

Midori (1:01:51)
Thank

Courtney Ginder (1:01:59)
Yes.

Midori (1:02:00)
Well, I think we have lots to talk about in our future conversation.

Courtney Ginder (1:02:04)
hahahaha

Chelsea Myers (1:02:05)
I

think we do too. I think we do too.

Midori (1:02:08)
I

mean, this is a beautiful, it's a beautiful conversation that we all get to be a part of if we're, I feel like if we're going to change actual generations of like what the conversation gets to look like. Cause I do think that there's a unifying force around mom saying like, enough's enough, like quit attacking our kids. Like let's like create a real conversation of like, let's gain understanding and love for one another. And like why, why we do.

Courtney Ginder (1:02:19)
Mm-hmm.

Chelsea Myers (1:02:32)
Yeah, and excuse my language,

but like, fuck the system. And that's what it's gonna take. But that's what it's gonna take. It's gonna take, fuck the patriarchy, but it's gonna take us moms, it's gonna take us moms or parents or whoever or whatever you identify as, and it's gonna take us saying no.

Courtney Ginder (1:02:36)
Yeah. Yes! For real!

Britt (1:02:38)
of the patriarchy.

Chelsea Myers (1:02:54)
And it's going to take us looking at these people who are trying to do these things to us, which is so scary. It's so scary. let's, we, again, we're going to talk about so much of this in future episodes because we're, this is not going to be a two hour episode. We're not going to do that to you. but like, it's going to take us saying no, no, and we're going to protect our kids. and we're going to ensure that our kids are kind human beings. And if that means.

Midori (1:02:58)
Yeah.

Courtney Ginder (1:03:00)
Mm-hmm.

Yes.

Midori (1:03:18)
Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (1:03:24)
leaving the fucking country. And I mean, I hope it doesn't because I would like to make things better here. But I mean, I think there's so, so much more that we have to talk about. But I think we're moms and our kids are waking up and or need to be picked up. So I just

Midori (1:03:25)
Thank

Courtney Ginder (1:03:30)
Yes.

Midori (1:03:46)
Hahaha

Courtney Ginder (1:03:47)
Mm-hmm. Or they're having a

collective meltdown over a pop tart. That's literally what's happening in my downstairs right now. I... won't...

Chelsea Myers (1:03:53)
Dude, what I wouldn't give for a Pop-Tart. that's what I'm thinking. haven't...

Britt (1:03:53)
fine.

I haven't had a Pop Tart in forever, actually. That sounds pretty great. The brown sugar

ones? Top notch.

Chelsea Myers (1:04:01)
Do you toast it? Toast it with butter. Toast it with butter. Yes. See? See? Okay, we can all come together at the end of this episode to agree on toasting your brown sugar Pop-Tarts.

Midori (1:04:02)
Toasted. Oh, with butter. Now that's spicy.

Courtney Ginder (1:04:03)
Yes, yes, exactly.

Britt (1:04:07)
Yes.

Courtney Ginder (1:04:09)
hahahaha

Midori (1:04:13)
Bye.

Yeah, I'll make a sourdough version. I'll try the rest and I'll share with you guys.

Chelsea Myers (1:04:20)
haha

Britt (1:04:21)
Yes!

Chelsea Myers (1:04:24)
yeah, so thank you guys. This was so much fun. I said that really weird. That's not how I talk at all. But yeah, no, I'm excited to do this again. And listeners also like don't expect, you never know when these are going to come out. So, no.

Courtney Ginder (1:04:28)
Yeah.

Britt (1:04:32)
It's fine, it's all fine.

Midori (1:04:33)
It's perfect.

You

Courtney Ginder (1:04:43)
Right.

Britt (1:04:43)
Yeah, this is not a time thing, man. We're all living in our

own little worlds out here trying to stay alive.

Midori (1:04:47)
Yeah, it's on this chaotic even.

Courtney Ginder (1:04:47)
Thank

Midori (1:04:49)
Stay on your toes.

Chelsea Myers (1:04:49)
Yeah, stay on your toes, expect

Courtney Ginder (1:04:52)
Yes.

Chelsea Myers (1:04:53)
the unexpected, and who knows who you'll hear from next time.

Courtney Ginder (1:04:57)
I mean, that's basically

parenthood in a nutshell. Really. Yes.

Midori (1:04:59)
Yeah, they're always on call.

Chelsea Myers (1:05:00)
Yeah

Britt (1:05:02)
Yeah.